New to Lacrosse officiating tips

[3rdPersonPlural]

We had a tremendous response to Stormlax's thread asking for what challenges a 35 year lacrosse player/coach would encounter in his first attempt at officiating.

http://www.lacrosseforums.com/showthread.php?t=104287

There is a different kind of challenge that faces an experienced official coming to lax from another sport. My observation is that these imports tend to become competent refs just as quickly as former players, but the learning curve is utterly different.

If an experienced official from another sport joins your regional crew, what advice would you offer him?

[NCLAXREF]

Just some thoughts:

Watch as many games as possible. - ASK QUESTIONS
Learn Tech and Personal list ASAP.
Explain terms. On the fly, in the box, locked in, let them cut, GLE etc....

[laxzeeb]

To me it is the mechanics. I would anticipate as the sport grows many refs from football might take the plunge since it is a spring field sport that compliments their fall activities. You can know the rules but you need to be in the right place and know what your responsibilities are to enforce them. The concept of the mechanics will be easy to understand for a football ref, given they have their own, so they will understand the importance of learning them for this sport.

[goalie1500]

Just base your calls on the 1-rules 2-Players skill level or athleticness (i mean at age 14-18 your gonna have to let some checking/body contact slide) 3-Your view of the game when your there( I mean if one team is up by 15 and the other team has only 10 players and the other team is being too rough or uneccesary) I don't mean play sides just watch lax games and when your there it will naturally come just watch and make good calls at the right times. Keep it fair

[Woodenstick]

I think "imports" have less trouble with mechanics and assertiveness than former players. Instead the problems for imports are knowing the rules and understanding which potential fouls are trivial and which must be called. Former players usually have a better feeling for the flow of the game and what can be allowed and what cannot. The best examples are judgment fouls like pushing, slashing and UR. The way to solve this is to do what NCLAX says, watch games and watch high quality officials. And of course pay attention to this forum.

[BlueJaysLaxFan]

This applies to newbies to officiating including former players, and officials from other sports:
1. Ask your partner for feedback and critique during and after a game
2. Be open (not defensive) to feedback and criticism from your partner
3. Read the rulebook, again and again (lax is more complicated than other sports, and if you played you'd be amazed at how many rules you do not know or have interpreted differently)
4. Ask questions on and off of the field
5. Watch games officiated by senior referees and observe what they call and how they manage the game
6. As you become comfortable with the rules and mechanics, start to pay more attention to game management skills (existing officials from other sports may already have this skill, but don't throw a flag for a USC immediately when a warning would first suffice)
7. Read this forum
8. Ask questions on this forum
9. When in doubt, read and ask questions on this forum again

[CardinalPuff]

my advice would include the word patience....i would strongly suggest starting during the "off season" with youth lacrosse and working as many games as possible......

[eme]

the Latin root of patience is "pati": to suffer

[BlueJaysLaxFan]

However, learning to officiate is not a sisyphean task.

[wolfenburg]

all the above are good point but i will focus on the
what a new official should know about Lacrosse:

- slow whistle. In most games you stop play if there is a foul.

- a foul is a serious thing in Lacrosse. Unlike field Hockey where a free hit means just go on, in Lacrosse a penalty has consequenzes.

[scott68111]

3PP, Good start here. As a 22 yr football veteran, I agree with Woodenstick, the mechanics of working a game and dealing with coaches and players without hitting the USC flag right away have come pretty easy. Knowing what is and isn't a foul (not the textbook definition) is the part that came around as last season wore on. I am fortunate enough to get to work with 2 very experienced guys who I have pinged for feedback after every game. Even one of our local junior coaches is a COC official and every time I work one of his games I shoot him an email the next day asking for a report. Watching a game with an experienced official to ask questions to has also helped. I watched one by myself and even with taking notes, i forgot some of the things I was going to ask about. With an experienced guy right there, it was much easier to turn to him and say what was that of why did they do that. Like I said in another post, last year I was a little nervous about getting out on the field, this year, I can not wait!!! I have 30+ yrs breing around football and love the feeling I get right before a kickoff, I can now honestly say I feel the same way about lax, bring it on!!!

[NewRefInGA]

I was hoping I could find a thread like this.

I am new to Lacrosse, but have been a football official for 9 years. I've always enjoyed watching the game, but never had the opportunity to play.

As someone mentioned earlier, I decided to get involved in Lacrosse becasue I was looking for something to stay active in the spring.

From a VERY limited exposure, it seems like the mechanics are not or -will not be -as difficult as some of the rules. One thing that seems different though, and I may have interpreted this incorrectly- is that in football, in most cases "wider is better" so that you see the whole play whereas in Lacrosse, that does not always hold true. (For GLE situations, etc.)

I am studying the rules, and will continue to do so. For what it's worth, my biggest concern is not when to call certain fouls, but whether to call them.

One of the most important lessons I learned as a football official was "Just because you can, doesn't mean you should" call a foul.

Unfortuntely, I think the only way to get to that point is experience. Fortunately, thee are a whole lot of opportunities for me to get experience here in GA, as it seems like Lacrosse is growing extremely fast.

I am really excited about the upcoming season, and this forum as a way to learn. Please bear with some of the weird questions I may ask in upcoming posts.

[eme]

We love weird questions.

[3rdPersonPlural]

Welcome to the forum, NewLax!

A few tips that your excellent post inspired:

1, 'Safe, fair, and fun...in that order' should be your mantra. All else is just commentary.

2, Hopefully you'll be paired up with a senior official. Mirror his judgement. Let him first determine those judgement calls, like what's slashing and what's a tough but legal stick check, and then try to use that same criteria for yourself. That will make everything 'fair', or at least consistent.

3, always consult with your partner right after the whistle when your flag is down. Tell him what you saw and what you think the right call is. It's his job (unofficially) to keep the calls consistent, so if you overflagged he can underpenalize, or vice versa. Remember, just like in football, you're the third team on the field, and your partner is not going to try to embarrass you, but you make that easy if you try to think and judge like you see him doing.

4, as a new lax official, you will see lots of actions that could well be interpreted as a penalty, and your partner will see the same thing but not flag it. Ask. At the next dead ball inquire about a specific scenario, and listen to the answer. This is the best way to get the 'spirit' of officiating down, and learn to work within the framework of your fellow refs.

[inblack]

further to 3PP

Excellent points by the way ....

Outside of safety and obvious violent situations, remember Advantage Disadvantage.
Did he gain an unfair advantage through his actions?
Did he prevent a fair advantage through his actions?
When and when not to apply this.

If you area is like ours there are many games at a single location each day. When you are not on the field go watch the other referees officiate. Sit and watch with a more experiences senior referee if possible.
Watch some draws through a set of binoculars (long telephoto camera lens) want to learn how players cheat on the draw, ... this is a great way to see it.

Like 3PP said don't be afraid to ask questions. We don't bite. At least not fellow officials.

[NewRefInGA]

Thank you all for your advice.

Now, here's my first question:

I am the Lead official, which would normally put me in position at the Goal Line Extended (for purposes of this question on the right wing). A1 has possession and runs into the corner on my wing.

In football, on a play at the goal line, I would give ground to the sideline and beyond to keep all of the action in front of me. That doesn't seem entirely practical in Lacrosse, because if (when) A1 passes the ball to a teammate at the top of the crease, I'm screwed.

The other option would be to stay in position near the crease, and pivot to keep both the goal and the player in possession in sight. ( I can't imagine that I would ever want to turn my back on the goal).But that doesn't give me a real good vantage point for Out of Bounds, etc.

My instinct tells me to give ground to the sideline, then run like hell toward the goal when A1 passes the ball.

Any thoughts?

[LaxRef]

My instinct tells me to give ground to the sideline, then run like hell toward the goal when A1 passes the ball.

Any thoughts?

Give ground to the sideline, then run like hell toward the goal when A1 passes the ball. :chuckle:

Seriously, as the lead you live on the GLE. You yo-yo in and out, getting as close to the crease as the players let you (but never closer than about 2 yards).

Realistically, you don't need to be as far out as the farthest player, just as far out as you need to be to stay out of the passing lane. I wish I could draw this, but suppose A1 is behind the goal and A2 is about 5 yards above the GLE and 10 yards toward the sideline from the midline of the field (i.e., he's 5 yards up and 10 yards to the right from the center of the goal line). You don't need to be 10 yards from the center of the goal line, you just need to be outside the line connecting A1 and A2. Of course, that's a fine point, and if you're out there with A2 you'll still be okay.

I hope that helps!

[3rdPersonPlural]

Always keep the play in front of you. Move as far out as you need to to accomplish this.

[inblack]

I asume that we are talking about two man mecahnics here.

CLA and ILF mechanics ....
In the event that this is a three man game, and you are on lead, then the trail is on the same side of the field as you are.

The sideline is the Trail's responsibility and the end line is the Lead's.
If the play is near GLE and at the sideline Lead keeps to the crease and the Trail moves to cover the sideline, while the Single Side sneaks in to cover for the Trail.

If the play is in the corner, then the Trail shifts out to cover the Sideline, the Lead drops back longitudally (sp?) to cover the End Line, while the Single Side moves in to cover the Crease.

Move your feet to get there turn your body and keep your shoulders square to the field/players, this way you will always have the most of the players and action in front of you.

[NewRefInGA]

Sorry, inblack, I should have clarified- yes, this is 2-man mechanics.

As far as I know that is all that we run in GA. I don't know if it chnges for the playoffs or not, but at this point, I don't think I'll have to worry about playoffs for a while.

Ok, here's another question:

On a face-off, official gives set command, players take position. In the Rules book, (4-3-1(exception 4)) states "If a player moves his crosse or any part of his body after "set" is said AND THEREBY GAINS AN ADVANTAGE, the ball shall be awarded to the offended team.

In the MDOC Training guide, it says once players are set they must remain motionless- after players are in position, any subsequent backing out, repositioning, etc. is penalized with illegal procedure.

My question- do you penalize ONLY if you perceive an advantage has been gained, or is it automatic?

I would think that if A1 moved but it did not cause B1 to move or effect the face in other ways, it could be ignored, and I would speak to the player at the next opportunity, rather than calling it. If it happens again, then call it.

Other, more experienced, officials I have spoken to about this say there is no way it could not create an advantage, so you call it everytime.

what do you all think?

[3rdPersonPlural]

I go with the MDOC that movement is a head start and therefore an advantage.

I try to vary my cadence from really fast - no pause between the set and the whistle - to a very brief pause.

Forcing teenaged boys to dangle on the precipice of action for too long is cruel and unusual officiating, IMHO.

[scott68111]

New Ref, Last year one of my on field partners who knw football put it like this...On a faceoff if either player moves after set, it is like a false start in football when a restricted lineman moves (signal is even the same). We have a large number of new teams with inexperienced lax players, early in the season early in a gaame it was not unusual to stand both FOGOs up and reset them to get a fair draw or sometimes we would never have a faceoff!!! Later in the season, based on the development of the players, we tightened up and called the faceoffs pretty tight with little leeway. What part of GA are you working??? Charleston SC here!!! Have fun and 3 weeks until the big jamboree, can't wait!!!

[NewRefInGA]

Scott, I'm about 30 minutes NW of Atlanta. There don't seem to be any schools that field Lacrosse teams outside of metro Atlanta, and most of the schools that do are on my side of town- which is a nice change from the hassles I go through on friday nights in the fall. It can take longer to get to and from the game than it takes to play the actual game.

For a 7:30 kickoff we have a showup time of 5:45, dress by 6, conduct pregame, then on the field by 7. There are times that I would have to leave work at 2:00pm to make a 30 mile drive to get to the game on time. In fact there was one time that I had to do pregame by cell phone and dress in the car as I was sitting in traffic on the highway. The game was 35 miles away- left work at 3:00, and got to the stadium as the captains were walking out for the coin toss.

(That was off the subject, I know, but it's a big problem for recruiting- and retention of officials).

By the way, I love Charleston. When I win the lottery, I'm buying a beachfront house on Isle of Palms and retiring.

[3rdPersonPlural]

NewRef, show up 20 minutes before a lax game. Certify the coaches and chat up the table. Do the game. Go home. Log on here and holler about how confused you were.

Ignore the odious Cardinal Puff.

Lather. Rinse. Repeat.

[CardinalPuff]

Ignore the odious Cardinal Puff.


now that is sound advice...

[scott68111]

I worked a game with Northview in Greenville last year, and then Savannah LC, no other GA schools!!! We don't quite have those traffic problems but if there is a problem on a bridge, might as well forget it!!! Worst trip was going to a small school about 45 miles from the house, gave myself 1.5 hrs got stuck in traffic, not moving, got out and 3 cars behind me was the visiting team!!! We got to the site of the game about 5 min before kickoff with the visitors right behind us. After we dressed, met home coach and he asked if we were going to flag the visitors for not being ready to start. Asked him if he was serious and he was totally serious, needless to say we did not start off on the best of terms!!!

Hey when you get that house on IOP, don't forget us lowly LAX officials!!!!

[3rdPersonPlural]

Scott, most lax games are played on a football field. That field is too narrow by several yards.

if the home coach is being unreasonable before a game, tell him his field is too narrow and the the penalties negate each other.

[scott68111]

3PP, I just told him it had no effect on the game and we were going to play, end of story!!! when it was all said and done great game!!! As a rule around here, we don't penalize field issues, we report them to the league and let them deal with it. A few of our teams are lucky to have a field, let alone one that exists to the letter of the rule!!! Lets play some lax!!!!!

[Woodenstick]

A better answer to the coach who wanted a flag for the visitor arriving late would be that IP is only for "avoidable" lateness. Traffic delays, medical emergencies, and bus troubles all qualify as unavoidable. In fact, unless the coach tells me he stopped for a couple of cold ones, I am probably going to let it go. :-)

[LaxRef]

Scott, most lax games are played on a football field. That field is too narrow by several yards.

NFHS rules allow for a field 53 1/3 yards to 60 yards wide. The attack area must be 40 x 35.

[LaxRef]

A better answer to the coach who wanted a flag for the visitor arriving late would be that IP is only for "avoidable" lateness. Traffic delays, medical emergencies, and bus troubles all qualify as unavoidable. In fact, unless the coach tells me he stopped for a couple of cold ones, I am probably going to let it go. :-)

The avoidable part is true, but it's not a flag, it's just possession (it's a technical foul with neither team in possession since a fac-eoff is pending).

[Carroll81]

Looks like I picked the right time to start monitoring the Board again. I am coming back for my second year in Lacrosse, am in my 12th year in hockey.

The first thing I wish I had known last year was to start with even lower level games. Why? - because of the darn counting. Around here, the high school and JV starts a month before youth and middle school, so I started with JV games where the counts are in effect. It wasn't until I did my first game where there were no counts that I really felt I was into the flow of the game and calling the "right" penalties, no feeling that I was missing things. Having to do counts, watch for penalties and be the official scorer is a lot for the newbie.

The other thing I wished they taught more in the seminars here was simply where to be looking while play is going on in various parts of the field. They taught where to run and where to stand, but not where to look. Again, at the beginning I think I was so concerned with the counts that I tended to focus on the ball rather than a bigger field of view. I quickly learned to ask my partners about that when I first met them at the games.

Good luck! You are going to love it.

[scott68111]

Carroll, we get on the field 9 Feb with a big jamboree in teh upstate, 200 miles one way but an entire day of lacrosse to kick the season off, great way to start!!! Last yr had teams from 3 states, was a blast, first time on the field, now I kind of know what I am doing, can't wait!!!