5 d men blocking the goal

[laxlux]

I believe this is legal, but seek opinions. Team A is ahead by 1 goal and there's one minute left. Team A assembles four players in the crease on the goal line with goalie a step ahead of them, also in the crease. The effect is to have physically blocked 90% of the open area and all within the goal can defend themselves with their sticks.

Also, imagine this same scanrio with all four wearing goalie pads.

[LaxRef]

I believe this is legal, but seek opinions. Team A is ahead by 1 goal and there's one minute left. Team A assembles four players in the crease on the goal line with goalie a step ahead of them, also in the crease. The effect is to have physically blocked 90% of the open area and all within the goal can defend themselves with their sticks.

I can't think of a rule that could be used to prohibit this, unless you ruled unsportsmanlike conduct, but I think that would be stretching it. Maybe someone else can think of something.

OTOH, all those bodies are going to get in each other's way, and the D-men won't have any goalie priviliges. Also, the offense will be able to get a completely wide open shot, with a good windup and lots of power. I guess if it were a good strategy then teams would do it.

Also, imagine this same scanrio with all four wearing goalie pads.

Define "goalie pads." You aren't allowed to wear hockey blockers, and anyone can wear a chest protector if he wants to do so. I don't see how wearing "goalie pads" changes the scenario.

Goalies don't need to wear arm pads or shoulder pads; they must wear chest protectors and lacrosse throat protectors. You may only have one designated goalkeeper on the field (and in NCAA you MUST have exactly one); the designated goalkeeper must use a stick 10"-12" wide at the widest point.

[eme]

Scene 1: that would leave a 6 on 2 advantage for the attacking team...fire away!

Scene: With or without required or allowed goalie equipment, the D men would occupy the same space because NCAA/Federation goalie pads do not stick out sideways from the body as in the NLL: chest protector, throat protector, and optional football pant thigh pads, shin protection.

[TheKOB]

tactics wise, probably two defensemen (short poles preferably) behind the goalie would be sufficiant, and then I'd use the other 4 in a box, and play like I was 2 men down.

So laxref, if there are two guys in the crease (1 d and 1 goalie) is only one of them allowed to clamp on the ball without being checked? If that's the case, what happens if the goalie is no longer in the crease, does the D man assume goalie priviladges?

[LaxRef]

tactics wise, probably two defensemen (short poles preferably) behind the goalie would be sufficiant, and then I'd use the other 4 in a box, and play like I was 2 men down.

So laxref, if there are two guys in the crease (1 d and 1 goalie) is only one of them allowed to clamp on the ball without being checked? If that's the case, what happens if the goalie is no longer in the crease, does the D man assume goalie priviladges?

NO! Only the designated goalie--the guy with the throat protector, chest protector, and goalie crosse--gets the crease protections. If your goalie is out of the crease, too bad for you. (NFHS may be different; this is NCAA)

In NCAA rules, you MUST have a legally-equipped goaltender on the field; if the goalie gets a penalty, he must serve it (NCAA and NFHS). However, IIRC, NFHS doesn't say you need to replace the penalized goalie with another one, while NCAA does.

And in any case, the goalie's stick can be checked if he clamps the ball outside the crease. If the goalie's stick is inside the crease, it can't be checked whether or not there is possession. If the stick is outside the crease but the goalie has possession and still has one foot inside the crease, his stick cannot be checked.

[TRELAX]

this play is pretty broken its the armindilo of defensive stradegies.

[TheKOB]

NO! Only the designated goalie--the guy with the throat protector, chest protector, and goalie crosse--gets the crease protections. If your goalie is out of the crease, too bad for you. (NFHS may be different; this is NCAA)

In NCAA rules, you MUST have a legally-equipped goaltender on the field; if the goalie gets a penalty, he must serve it (NCAA and NFHS). However, IIRC, NFHS doesn't say you need to replace the penalized goalie with another one, while NCAA does.

And in any case, the goalie's stick can be checked if he clamps the ball outside the crease. If the goalie's stick is inside the crease, it can't be checked whether or not there is possession. If the stick is outside the crease but the goalie has possession and still has one foot inside the crease, his stick cannot be checked.

That's why I asked the question.

I thought only if it was a personal (1 min) penalty then the goalie had to serve it...

Also, would the ref allow another goalie time to be warmed up? I've read somewhere that the coach just has to ask....

[laxlux]

The goalie pads in question wuld be chest protectors to fend of conerns about heart safety. I'd love to see someone try this in a practice scrimmage, with perhaps just the two d men. I swear this will work because you are simply erecting a wall to the goal.

[LaxRef]

That's why I asked the question.

I thought only if it was a personal (1 min) penalty then the goalie had to serve it...

This is a pervasive myth! There is nothing in the rulebook--either NCAA or NFHS, AFAIK--that permits someone to serve a penalty for the goalie (with, of course, the exeception that the goalie in question is not in the game and he gets a penalty, in which case the in-home serves it).

Actually, the more pervasive myth is that the goalie only serves USC fouls. I think this myth comes from ice hockey.

Anyway, the bottom line is that if the goalie gets a penalty, whether it's offsides, a push from behind, a conduct foul, a slash, or a USC, he serves the penalty.

Also, would the ref allow another goalie time to be warmed up? I've read somewhere that the coach just has to ask....

It depends. In NFHS, they get a 1:00 warmup. In NCAA, we're supposed to be "reasonably lenient," especially regarding, say, a club team with only one set of goalie gear. Typically, we'll give the team time to switch over the equipment without making them call a timeout. However, if they want to get their starting goalie back in the game after the penalty expires, they need to cal a timeout (or wait until the end of the period or until the other team calls a timeout).

Under NCAA rules, you must call a timeout if you wish to warm up a goalie.

Of course, if you have two or more fully equipped goalies, they can sub on the fly just like anyone else.

[Laxref_36]

That's why I asked the question.

I thought only if it was a personal (1 min) penalty then the goalie had to serve it...

Also, would the ref allow another goalie time to be warmed up? I've read somewhere that the coach just has to ask....

Coach,

Whether you're playing by the NCAA or the NFHS rules, the goalkeeper must serve all penalty time regardless of whether that foul is personal or technical.

In regard to allowing the goalie time to warmup, the NCAA and the NFHS differ on how that is handled. In the 2004 NFHS rule book (I haven't got the 2005 book yet), Page 42, Rule 7 Article 4 states. "If the goalkeeper is penalized or injured, the official will allow a full one-minute delay for replacing the goalie on the field beginnning with his warm-up." The 2004 NCAA Lacrosse Men's Rules book makes no provision.

[LaxRef]

The goalie pads in question wuld be chest protectors to fend of conerns about heart safety. I'd love to see someone try this in a practice scrimmage, with perhaps just the two d men. I swear this will work because you are simply erecting a wall to the goal.

Anyone can wear a chest protector, although there's no evidence that it prevents impact-related heart problems at this point.

And, well, you can try it, but I'd be surpised if it would work, simply because no one does it. Certainly against a good team, say D1, they're going to be happy to get lots of wide-open shots since they'll be able to aim for and hit the open spots.

It's probably been tried, and if it had been successful then other teams would have picked it up. Of course, it might be a good strategy in, say, JV ball, but then your team wouldn't be learning how to play proper defense and by the time you got to varsity ball you'd probably be screwed because you wouldn't know what to do.

If you try it, be sure to get back to us about how it works.

[Snake~eyes]

The 'myth' probaly also comes from the fact that that is how some leagues play, little league and off season leagues because sometimes they only one set of pads OR even only one goalie.

[LaxRef]

The 'myth' probaly also comes from the fact that that is how some leagues play, little league and off season leagues because sometimes they only one set of pads OR even only one goalie.

You're right. I just wish they'd tell people that it's a made-up rule when they do that.