View Full Version : Can you call it?
lehighvalleylax
04-01-2005, 09:25 PM
I need your help on this situation.
Team A is man up and is bringing the ball down from midfield. Ball is in play and team A had 11 men on the field with 7 in the offensive side of the field. A2 is called out of the game by coaches and no call/stoppage of play has occurred. He leaves thru the substitution box and is out of the box when ref blows whistle and stops play and calls "illegal substitution" and turns the ball over.
Obviously, the call should be illegal procedure for more than 10 men on the field, but my question is. Can A still be called for this even after it is no longer happening?? A has 10 men on the field at the time the whistle is blown and play stopped.
Any thoughts???
CoachRob
04-01-2005, 09:36 PM
IP for too many men on the field. Loss of possession to team B. The ref DID see it. The fact he didn't blow the whistle in time doesn't negate the fact they had too many men on the field.
An analogous situation is a goal disallowed when the ref finds the scorer used an illegal crosse during a dead ball stick inspection following a goal. Even though the ball is now dead, it is still an illegal situation as it was in use during a live ball situation.
In the case of too many men, the delay in recognition does not change the fact it needs to be penalized, IMO.
Another case is the ball enters the goal, then the ref blows the whistle for an offside violation prior to the goal. The delay in blowing the whistle does not negate the fact the scoring team was offside at the time. Goal is disallowed. You have to recall that the infraction is what determines the timing of the penalty, NOT when the official finally gets the whistle into his mouth to toot it.
LaxRef
04-01-2005, 10:02 PM
CoachRob is right. The violation doesn't have to be called at the moment it takes place; sometimes it takes a moment to make sure you have the right call before you make it. Another example: you see a guy run off with a long pole, and then you look back to the field and see 4 more long poles on the field. Even though they no longer have 5 long poles on the field, you know they did,, so you flag it.
laxref39
04-02-2005, 08:45 AM
Count em twice and get it right!!!
LaxRef
04-02-2005, 08:58 AM
Count em twice and get it right!!!
Exactly! If you don't call it early enough, you can fix it, but if you blow the whistle when you shouldn't have, you can't undo it.
lehighvalleylax
04-05-2005, 08:07 AM
If Team A call for a timeout (a) before ref sees too many men or (b) before ref whistles and stops play for too many men, can they call it after the timeout has been granted???
The procedure is this:
Whistle. "Team A has too many men on the field. Coach, would you still like your time out?"
LaxRef
04-05-2005, 08:39 AM
If Team A call for a timeout (a) before ref sees too many men or (b) before ref whistles and stops play for too many men, can they call it after the timeout has been granted???
For Team A to call timeout, they have to have possession. If the official notices that there were too many men, he should award the ball to team B for the illegal procedure and then, as eme points out, ask if team A still wants the timeout. Even though they no longer have possession, it's now a dead-ball situation and they can call for a TO if they want it.
A timeout call cannot cancel out a foul. Consider:
Team A has possession. A1 slashes B1 and Team A coach calls timeout immediately. Official throws flag. Coach yells "You can't do that! I called timeout before you threw the flag!"
Silly, huh?
Regarding violations and TOs...when a coach asks for a TO at what appears to be a weird time...ref's radar should go up....start counting the players in his offensive end because it is likely he has too many men on the field.