Media Poll Apr. 11, JHU Unanimously #1..

[hbmedic]

Inside Lacrosse Media Poll
April 11, 2005
1. Hopkins (8-0)- 425 (17 first place votes)
2. Duke (11-1)- 405
3. Virginia (8-1)- 394
4. Georgetown (6-2)- 358
5. Army (9-1)- 350
6. Syracuse (5-3)- 347
7. Navy (8-2)- 328
8. Cornell (5-2)- 294
9. Maryland (5-4)- 286
10. UMass (7-2)- 258
11. Notre Dame (6-3)- 244
12. Dartmouth (5-2)- 218
13. Bucknell (6-3)- 209
14. Towson (7-3)- 182
15. Denver (6-2)- 172
16. Yale (6-2)- 167
17. Hofstra (5-6)- 122
18. Albany (6-3)- 110
19. Brown (3-3)- 87
19. Stony Brook (6-3)- 74

Others receiving votes: Hobart 73, Fairfield 60, Villanova 51, Loyola 36, UMBC 25, Delaware 23, Penn State 11, Harvard 6, Princeton 4, North Carolina 3, Rutgers 3, Colgate 3, Drexel 2
Moving in: Yale, Stony Brook
Dropping out: Hobart (14), Loyola (17)

Finally Hopkins has quieted the people who doubted them. Now the season is winding down for some teams and a little over half over for others.. Hopefully Hopkins can finally hang on and win it all.. There was a team autographed Hopkins '05 helmet on e-bay that ended on Saturday, I expected the bidding to go nuts after the Duke win, but it ended up at $360.. The team autographed Syracuse championship helmet worn by Brian Crockett last season went for $470.. I'm suprised considering if Hopkins goes undefeated and wins the championship, I think the Hopkins helmet will go for more.. Have a great week.. hbm :thumbsup:

[jmplax31]

I'm glad Delaware was taken off the top 20. The got smashed my Hofstra, they need to earn their spot. :nahya:

[KoachKream]

how much longer are people going to pretend that princeton and UNC are good? they are still receiving votes and princeton has only one win. what gives?

[hbmedic]

Carolina and Princeton are excellent programs that spend a lot of money, time, and resources on lacrosse. Bill Tierney is one of the greatest and most respected coaches of all time. 50% or more of each freshman class each year at Princeton are HS All Americans.. Last year Virginia began the year 1-4 and remained ranked.. Its more than wins and losses.. Princeton is a very bad team this year, with 2 freshman starting at attack, 1 at midfield, 2 on defense, and the goalie all freshman.. That is a lot of inexperience to overcome.. Carolina this season has beaten 2 top 15 teams.. What other unranked team has done that?! Can you honestly say to yourself that Carolina would not beat Stoney Brook, Albany, Yale, (already beat Denver), Bucknell, Dartmouth, or Towson?! If you can honestly say that your just a hater.. But thats fine, you can have your fun this season.. because you know those two teams will be back next year.. Just like Virginia last year, and look at them now.. 1 loss, and a #3 ranking.. Hopkins, Virginia, Maryland, Syracuse, Carolina, and Princeton will have years where they just don't click, where they don't quite make it.. But one thing you can count on is that they will be back.. All of the other teams are the exact opposite.. They have years where they click and things fall together and they win, but you can't count on em' to do it year after year.. Name another team that has 4 straight years of home wins in a row.. Hopkins has 32 straight home wins, a school record.. The entire Sr. class of Hopkins has never lost at home in their 4 years at Hopkins.. Syracuse has been to 22 straight NCAA final fours.. Princeton and Carolina will be back and they deserve respect in the rankings.. Your complaining that they received some votes.. Thats ridiculous.. Thats just jealousy talking.. Who's your team, I'd be interested to know.. that would probably be funny.. hbm

[cannonslax624]

Why do you feel the need to personally attack all those who say that a 1-5 TEAM DOES NOT DERSERVE TO BE RANKED?! This is the list of Top 20 Best Teams in College, not TOP 20 RESPECTED COLLEGE PROGRAMS! Great, I agree, they'll be back next year, but THAT IS NOT WHAT THIS POLL IS ABOUT! IS IT?! NO! It's about the top 20 college teams, and THIS YEAR, PRINCETON AND UNC ARE NOT IN THERE! Maybe next year, but NOT this year!

[tekz]

Because he is a deusche and feels as if he is the smartest man on the planet. And let me save you some time by saying that I already know your life story and how long you've been involved in the lacrosse community, so I don't need to hear it again.

[hbmedic]

Okay so lets discuss this, and also, I do not see any personal attack in my reply..

#1 Hopkins has obviously Kicked everyone's A$$ in D1, all Top 20..
#2 Duke - Has beaten #9 Maryland by 2, and #4 G'town by 9; all of their other wins are Unranked..
#3 Virginia - Beat #6 Syracuse by 1, #9 Maryland by 9, and #14 Towson by 11.. all of their remaining wins are unranked..
#4 G'Town - Lost to #9 Maryland by 7, and Duke by 9; Wins against #6 Syracuse by 3, and #7 Navy by 5.. All of their other wins are unranked.
#5 Army - Lost to #6 Syracuse by 5; Wins against #8 Cornell by 2, #13 Bucknell by 1, and #17 Hofstra by 1..
#6 Syracuse - Lost to #1 JHU by 1 in OT, #3 UVA by 1, and #4 G'town by 3..Beat #5 Army by 5, and #19 Brown by 1..
#7 Navy - Lost to #13 Bucknell by 1 ot, and #4 G'town by 5; Only ranked win against #9 Maryland by 1pt..
#8 Cornell - Wins against #11 Notre Dame by 1, and #16 Yale by 9; losses to #5 Army by 2 and Unranked Carolina by 5..
#9 Maryland - Losses to #2 Duke by 2, #12 Dartmouth by 1, #3 Virginia by 8, and #7 Navy by 1.. Wins against #4 G'town by 7, and #14 Towson by 4..
#10 UMASS - Losses to Unranked Loyola by 1, and #18 Albany by 1; Wins against #16 Yale by 6, #17 Hofstra by 5, #19 Brown by 7, and #13 Bucknell by 4. Finally a team that deserves to be here..
#11 Notre Dame - Lost to #15 Denver by 3, #12 Dartmouth by 1, #8 Cornell by 1.. 1 ranked win against #17 Hofstra by 1 in OT..
#12 Dartmouth - Lost to Sacred Heart by 1 ot, and #18 Albany by 2; Ranked wins vs. #9 Maryland by 1, and #11 Notre Dame by 1..
#13 Bucknell - Lost to Unranked Harvard by 3, #9 Maryland by 4, and #5 Army by 1; One ranked win, and their claim to fame against #7 Navy IN Overtime..
#14 Towson - Losses to Unranked Delaware by 6, #9 Maryland by 4, and #3 Virginia by 11.. One top 20 win vs. #15 Denver by 2 pts..
#15 Denver - Lost to Unranked Carolina (that name keeps coming up) by 6, and #14 Towson by 2; One ranked win vs. #11 Notre Dame by 3.
#16 Yale - Losses to #10 UMass by 6, and #8 Cornell by 9; One Ranked win against #19 Brown by 1 pt..
#17 Hofstra - Losses to #1 JHU by 6, Unranked Villanova by 6, and #19 Brown by 8.. No ranked wins.
#18 Albany - Losses to #1 JHU by 13, Unranked Delaware by 9.. One ranked win vs. #12 Dartmouth by 8..
#19 Brown - Losses to #10 UMass by 7, #6 Syracuse by 1, and #16 Yale by 1; Ranked win against #17 Hofstra by 8..
#19 Stony Brook - Losses to #5 Army by 1, #10 UMass by 3, #18 Albany by 3.. NO Ranked Wins..

Unranked teams with Ranked wins not in the rankings:
Loyola - Losses to #4 Towson by 2, UR Penn St by 4, #2 Duke BY 1 pt, and #6 Syracuse by 6.. With a ranked win vs. #10 UMass by 1 pt.
Delaware - Losses to UR Rutgers by 1, #19 Stony Brook by 5, #4 G'town by 1, and #17 Hofstra by 10.. Wins against #18 Albany by 9, and #14 Towson by 6.. They deserve to be ranked.
Harvard - Losses to #15 Denver by 1, and #8 Cornell by 10; ranked win vs. #13 Bucknell by 3..
Carolina - All of their losses are against Ranked teams - #17 Hofstra by 4, #11 Notre Dame by 2, #9 Maryland by 5, #1 JHU by 2, #2 Duke by 2, #3 UVA by 6, and #7 Navy by 3, No blowouts.. Ranked wins vs. #15 Denver by 6, and #10 Cornell by 4.. This team plays a very hard schedule, and any of the Teams between #14 and #20 given this schedule would be Winless and Unranked..

You have to put your bias and hatred for the perennial powers aside..Princeton and Carolina have very hard schedules.. and although they have few wins each, plug their schedule into a lot of the teams between 10 and 20 this season and their in the same place or even worse than Carolina and Princeton.. hbm

[stegmakk]

HBM...
Remember, these polls should be SNAPSHOTS in time, not what you think a team will do in the next 2 weeks.

Albany has 2 ranked wins. Dartmouth AND Umass.
I would bump SBU out and throw Loyola in the last spot...UNC is on the cusp.
I am definately not a UNC hater. I have been pulling for them the past 3 years. Each time they break down (not as harsh as this year). I still say they have/had the raw talent, it just hasn't been coached to its potential.
UNC does NOT deserve to be ranked. Granted it has got to be the TOUGHEST schedule...but they should have at least beat Hofstra and NotreDame to say the least. Their 2 ranked wins you talk about are their ONLY wins this year. One could argue that Dartmouth's wins were flukes, and that they are not that great of a team or one could argue that they are an excellent team that lost a few close ones. Same goes with Carolina. As you argue that UNC should be ranked and that they are a great team, I am arguing that they are not playing to potential, and those wins they got were no more important than Bucknell's upset wins, and that UNC if they really deserved to be ranked would have beaten those teams that they should have.

[hbmedic]

My point is to the people who wonder why Carolina and Princeton get respect every season until they lose a lot more games than other teams.. They get respect because their schedule would be impossible to half of the teams in the D1 poll and because they field 8+ ALL Americans everytime they walk on the field.. There are more all americans on Carolina (4 AA Fr./4 D1 AA incl 2 1st team)and Princeton (5 AA Fr/5 D1 AA) alone than on all of the teams ranked 13-20 combined.. That is why those teams get respect year after year.. Not because of the past.. Because of potential and strength of schedule..

The bottom line is, this year is a mess, every D1 team between #6-11 should be ashamed of themselves.. And especially Princeton and Carolina. With the Strength or their rosters there is something very wrong with those teams. Losses To Bucknell, Villanova, Dartmouth, and Denver are inexcusable and shameful.. And to all of the people who think I'm just biased, I hate Princeton.. But I respect their coach and their program immensely.. and they deserve it.. Carolina should be at least #19.. They haven't even played any unranked teams, and they have beaten 2 teams in the top 15.. No team in the bottom 6 can make that claim.. hbm

[Mavido]

[QUOTE=hbmedic]#1 Hopkins has obviously Kicked everyone's A$$ in D1, all Top 20.. [U]QUOTE]

I dont remember them beating everyone in D1 when they have only played 8 games, and i dont remember them beating Everyones A$$ when they only beat duke by one in what the second overtime? Stop being so bias..


And your supproting VA and PRINCTON! WHAT!! they arnt from MD or NY they are the worst Programs ever! isnt that right HBM?

[hbmedic]

I like Carolina because one of my best friends from HS went there, and because their roster is almost 90% from Maryland or New York.. Lets just look at this year, Carolina brought in 12 Freshman, 4 are all americans, 10 of those 12 Freshman are from New York or Maryland, and the other 2 are from North Carolina..
Princeton I don't like, and actually half of their team is not from Maryland or New York..They brought in 10 Freshman this year, 5 are HS all americans none of which are from Maryland or New York, and of their 10 Freshman only 4 are from Maryland or New York..

Now, even though you guys are deciding to insult me, and attack me rather than address the topic, I am not going to reply.. Your insults are ridiculous and everyone that reads this can tell who the person is who knows and has listed proof of their claims.. Hopkins beat Duke, Face it.. And if Rewkowski wasn't coming off of a knee injury which prevented him from playing in the Albany game and Kyle Barrie had been in (injured ankle) instead of the freshman that kicked Duke's butt and won the game (Huntley), Not to mention the poor play of the goalie for Hopkins, Duke wouldn't have even been in that game.. I would be willing to bet that Duke loses to Virginia this weekend.. and I can't wait.. There's the answer to your unnecessary insults and insinuations.. Sorry you can't just come here and list proof, analysis, and facts like I do.. hbm :bye:

[Mavido]

Im not offering proffs or analysis or facts, im simply pointing out your blatant bias... thats it..

[hbmedic]

Well if its worthwhile to you, then have at it.. I guess it serves some purpose.. Besides, what is my blatant bias?! And what are yours?! Because yours are more obvious.. I'm arguing for teams that have tough schedules regardless of their locations, and your arguing for Duke.. So lets talk about Duke.. 25 players on their roster are from New York or Maryland (17 NY / 8 MD), 2 players on their roster of 48 players are from North Carolina.. TWO.. Everyone else is from states between Virginia and New York.. They have one guy from Colorado.. They brought in 15 Freshman this season.. 6 are from New York or Maryland.. 2 are from Texas.. There are as many players on Duke's team from Texas as there are from North Carolina?! What does that say about lacrosse players in North Carolina?! Carolina has 3 players from North Carolina everyone else is from states between Virginia and Connecticut, they have one player from Tennessee.. Noone from west of that.. If anything Carolina has more loyalty than Duke.. Duke's team has meshed this year and obviously work well together.. Big deal.. Next year they'll be back in the teens where they belong.. hbm

[stegmakk]

Wait wait wait...How'd we get back on the what team has kids from where argument...This is a poll about the teams as teams and how they are playing. If a team has a bunch of all americans and can't play well or they are not being coached in the best of their abilities, then they don't deserve any more respect.

If you are talking about a poll keep doing it...I liked your posts with who beat who (although you missed Albany over UMass :)

Point is, based on results...SO FAR...UNC ok I'll bump them up to a tie with Loyola for #20.

[stegmakk]

Anyway, I am happy about Army's play, and the respect they are getting.
I still say Cuse is overated...The win over Army was lucky. They both playe very sloppy. I know I cant keep brining it up, but that is the only thing they can really lay claim to.
ND and Yale IMO should drop down...maybe out and let Loyola and UNC in the last two spots.

[hbmedic]

Syracuse beat Army by 5 goals.. Nah, I think Army will lose to Navy on Saturday and I don't think Navy is that good.. Navy wins on pure athleticism and conditioning and because of that they simply overcommit and overplay on defense.. that will kill you against good fundemental teams like Hopkins, and Virginia..

In all reality, I have no idea what the answers are this season, maybe I'm just frustrated.. I would absolutely love to see Carolina come out of nowhere and win the ACC tourney, and I would love to see Syracuse and Hopkins in the final of the tourney, that would shut everyone up, and knock all of the Duke bandwagoners off the wagon for this season.. Their just haters that want someone to come out of nowhere and beat the perennial powers.. Thats not right. Those teams work hard to compete at the top level every year, its not right to hate them just because..

hbm

[JHU43]

Funny thing about Princeton is that before 1990 they were noone in the world in college lax....If we give them some sort of credit today for their historical successes, we need to realize that that historical success only goes back about 14 years...They are a much younger "powerhouse" than JHU or Cuse or even UVA or UNC...I'm sure people will disagree, but maybe that period was only a fluke? A nice run, but nothing more? Just throwing it out there

[JHU43]

[QUOTE=RJRoffense][QUOTE=hbmedic]#1 Hopkins has obviously Kicked everyone's A$$ in D1, all Top 20.. [U]QUOTE]

"I dont remember them beating everyone in D1 when they have only played 8 games, and i dont remember them beating Everyones A$$ when they only beat duke by one in what the second overtime? Stop being so bias.. "

You're right that JHU hasn't been destroying everyone that they face by any traditional measure, but I think that they come closest to that title given the kind of season it's been. If not JHU, then who has been THE dominant team of this season? Aside from UVA and Duke (who each lost to JHU) every other team in D1 has at least one pretty weak loss...You're also right that they only have played 8 games, but let's look at those 8 games: Princeton, Hofstra, Syracuse (in the Dome), UVA, UNC, and Duke...Those are more quality teams than most D1 teams play in an entire season....Let's look at who's left on the Hopkins schedule: Maryland, Navy, Towson and Loyola....For me, one win over UVA is the equivalent of 4 fluff games against Penn State, St Mary, etc....There's no other team in D1 in which you can make a "dominant" argument with a straight face

[hbmedic]

You are correct JHU, Princeton's first appearance in the NCAA Tourney is 1990 as an un-seeded team and they didn't make the final four.. In 1991 they came in ranked #3 and lost to Towson in triple OT; In 1992 They came in seeded #2 and won the whole thing.. Since then they've only missed the final 4 - 3 times.. So they've had a good run.. they kind of took over as Carolina started to fade after a big run in the 80's...

SO I guess, looking at History, the 70's were dominated by Cornell, Maryland, and Hopkins.. The 80's dominated by Hopkins, Carolina, and Syracuse.. and the 90's dominated by Syracuse, and Princeton with more parity across the main D1 teams like Loyola, Carolina, Maryland, Virginia, and Towson.. And in this new century even more Parity seems to be expanding through D1 with Notre Dame and Towson in the 2001 Final 4, and Navy last year.. But still in 2000 and 2003, it was the perennial powers Princeton, Syracuse, and Hopkins.. I guess you could say the only Really dominant Final 4 team in the past 20 years would be Syracuse, but that is in serious jeapordy this year.. But now Hopkins is back on top.. So through all of the parity the powers that have been are still almost too much to overcome.. When the other 2 are weak the 3rd one shines through, and vice versa.. ya' know what I mean..

So anyway, good point..

Cmm.. My point about Navy is that their athleticism will get them only so far, especially in wet weather.. At some point you have to have the finesse and stick skills to overcome when your athleticism isn't quite enough.. Like in the rain in the G'Town game.. Its okay to have an overcommitting, aggressive, mostly athletic and well conditioned defense on sunny dry days, but there are going to be days when you need to be able to adjust to stick skill, ball movement, and finesse or eventually your going to lose..

hbm

[Mavido]

Ok, JHU is deffinatly a great team i will agree, and i am kinda sore about Duke losing, simply b/c im from NC.. But i felt that HBM was deffinatly being bias towards JHU, and he was but i must agree they are doing great this year, and probly have the hardest schedual of all the D1 teams this year, thats pretty impressive. but this year it deffinaty seems like there are no really dominating teams in my opinion.

None the less, i cant wait untill the NCAA torny.... especialy the final four.. b/c thats the only part i will see, they dont show any other games in the south and ill be in Philly for Memorial weekend..

[hbmedic]

Cmm.. Its been done.. Georgetown dominated Navy both days, the weather took away any physical advantage Navy has.. Their defense over-commit and were beat by the finesse and ball handling of G'town easily.. For some reason Richie Meade didn't adjust his defense to a zone according to the weather.. Either that, or he knows he defense can't play zone.. Better hope it doesn't rain during the tourney.. Their offense isn't as good as last year to take up the slack for the defense in the rain.. bye bye..
hbm