End cap??

[supermanjoe18]

hey refs,
whats the deal with end caps? Do you have to have one or can you take it off and just tape the end of the shaft? Also can you leave the end of the shaft so that it has a hole at the bottom with tape around it? If you could answer these questions i'd be much abliged

[mustang_lax]

there can be no metal showing at the bottom of the shaft...You can have a hole aslong as there is no metal going through. I myself tape my shaft bottom completely..it looks liek it's a end cap but it's all tape..I can ge tpics up later

[CoachRob]

NFHS 1-7.3
ART. 3 . . . All hollow crosse handles made of metal or synthetic material shall have a plastic or wood plug on the end or be adequately taped to prevent injury. A metal handle that does not have a cap-plug on the end shall not be considered illegal; at the next whistle, it shall be removed from the game until corrected

So if it's metal, it NEEDS an end cap. Otherwise, it will be removed from the field until it's corrected, but you do not serve any penalty time. A metal bottle cap (from a soda or beer bottle) is NOT an acceptable end cap. Most caps are plastic or rubber.

[waxon]

You can't just tape the edges. The whole bottom of the stick must be covered. That means no hole in the bottom. Also no metal bottle caps. I have a question coach rob, NFHS rules specify a plastic or rubber endcap. Would about the graphite ones on the end of the harrow howitzer.

[LCNlaxman]

Look in my webshots, in my sig, click on "Legally Taping."

This allows you to tape your butt end without an end cap. Basically, yes you can tape around the shaft to be considered having a "legal end cap"

[laxfolife24]

i had a brine matrix and when i bought it it said no end cap needed bcuz it was composite, or something along those lines. But i did end up putting an end cap on it.

[CoachRob]

You can't just tape the edges. The whole bottom of the stick must be covered. That means no hole in the bottom. Also no metal bottle caps. I have a question coach rob, NFHS rules specify a plastic or rubber endcap. Would about the graphite ones on the end of the harrow howitzer?

A graphite cap is fine, so long as there are no exposed sharp edges. What we're trying to avoid is exposed metal that can injure a player. While rubber and plastic are the cheapest and most common, other materials are adequate. The reason I mentioned bottle caps is because they are 1) metal; 2) have very sharp edges; and 3) not designed to properly fit over the shaft end. Failing all three of those requirements combine to make an inadequate end cap, and one that is also dangerous.

[CoachRob]

Look in my webshots, in my sig, click on "Legally Taping."

This allows you to tape your butt end without an end cap. Basically, yes you can tape around the shaft to be considered having a "legal end cap"

I viewed your site and the end is illegal. The hole in the end is dangerous. Taping is not considered adequate protection for the metal edge of a stick.

To repeat:
A metal handle that does not have a cap-plug on the end shall not be considered illegal; at the next whistle, it shall be removed from the game until corrected means that it's not illegal for purposes of penalties. But it is NOT legal to be used.

An end cap costs around $1.50. Just go buy one and do everybody a favor. What is it about the caps that bothers you? Does it interfere with your stick skills in any way?

If I'm reffing, it's out of the game but as I stated, no penalty against you.

[mustangmiddie21]

The rules you showed say "or be adequately taped to prevent injury". I can tape a stick up with the hole in the bottom to provide protection from the metal and will post pictures if you want to see it. I did not look at LCN so I'm not questioning his stick and Im not trying to be a ****.

[OGND]

Taping's fine- but cover the hole. It only takes one small extra piece of tape.

[CoachRob]

The rules you showed say "or be adequately taped to prevent injury". I can tape a stick up with the hole in the bottom to provide protection from the metal and will post pictures if you want to see it. I did not look at LCN so I'm not questioning his stick and I'm not trying to be a****.

I don't know why they say that because they also state:

A metal handle that does not have a cap-plug on the end shall not be considered illegal; at the next whistle, it shall be removed from the game until corrected meaning it cannot be used but there's no penalty.

This is more specific, and thus trumps the earlier statement. What is the objection to an endcap or plug? Does it interfere with anything other than providing MORE safety? Please fill me in on what the issue is.

[HdGLaxWarrior]

I just have a beer cap on it.

[OGND]

NCAA Rule 1-18, Note 2 allows tape, but specifically disallows the beer cap:
Note 2: All hollow crosse handles must have their exposed ends adequately covered with plastic, rubber or tape to prevent injury. The use of metal caps (e.g., bottle caps) are prohibited.
I don't think I've seen an actual end cap during a game in years. A end cap can fall off during play, making the stick dangerous, and subject to removal (but with no penalty, as CoachRob points out). Tape just works.

"Adequately taped" may be interpreted differently by different officials. So I suggest you cover your butt by covering the hole when you tape the end of your stick. :grin:

[RockStar]

^^
End cap never has to fall off. It can be glued on or taped on.

[CoachRob]

I just have a beer cap on it.

Well, that is EXPRESSLY prohibited by NFHS rules. Using a beer cap was specifically addressed this year. It was regarded as hazardous to all players and the stick is to te removed immediately.

I don't know what point you are trying to make by using a beer cap Warrior, but it is ILLEGAL.

You can do whatever you want, but just so you are clear you are breaking the rules.

[supermanjoe18]

thanks guys that helps

[Jpettit25]

If you're really a die-hard bottle cap user, you can keep it on. You've got to tape around it to secure it to the shaft, right? Well just throw one extra inch of tape covering the bottom of it, and you're set. Refs, am I wrong in this line of thought? The cap would be entirely taped over, therefore meeting "cap-plug in shaft" and "..adequately taped.." Regardless of what is under the tape?

[zebra618]

I have had problems with too much tape on the butt end of the stick - I personally think that it provides an unfair advantage during one-handed stick checks. I am referring to what amounts to a "donut" of tape in the butt end of the stick.

What do other refs call on this?

[CoachRob]

If you're really a die-hard bottle cap user, you can keep it on. You've got to tape around it to secure it to the shaft, right? Well just throw one extra inch of tape covering the bottom of it, and you're set. Refs, am I wrong in this line of thought? The cap would be entirely taped over, therefore meeting "cap-plug in shaft" and "..adequately taped.." Regardless of what is under the tape?

No, a bottle cap is not legal. What is difficult to comprehened in that statement? There was a memo that went out that SPECIFICALLY STATED bottle caps are NOT to be used. Period. End of sentence. So get the darned thing off, buy a regular end cap for $1.50, and be done with this. You can dance around this all you want: it's NOT legal.

Really now...

[AUSTINREF]

I have had problems with too much tape on the butt end of the stick - I personally think that it provides an unfair advantage during one-handed stick checks. I am referring to what amounts to a "donut" of tape in the butt end of the stick.

What do other refs call on this?

I've seen several of these "donuts" and have asked this very question. All my partners have said there isn't anything illegal about it, but the don't think it makes much sense.

[CoachRob]

The stick circumference cannot exceed 3.5"; there's nothing written about the end cap. The "tight butt", a special type of end plug, exceeds 3.5" and is entirely legal.

[Jpettit25]

I'll rephrase that. Will the referee ever untape my butt to see what's under it? I'm not trying to argue here, just trying to have a civil conversation; I don't like being talked down to. I understand that a bottlecap is illegal and, in a perfect world, would be called so when discovered. The question is though, how will the referee know that there is a bottlecap under there if it is entirely taped over?

[mustang_lax]

a BEER CAP or any other metal cap is illegal, however an aquafina waterbottle cap or coke cape will be legal. Also to answer your question, no, the ref wouldn't untape your butt end.

[Snake~eyes]

I'll rephrase that. Will the referee ever untape my butt to see what's under it? I'm not trying to argue here, just trying to have a civil conversation; I don't like being talked down to. I understand that a bottlecap is illegal and, in a perfect world, would be called so when discovered. The question is though, how will the referee know that there is a bottlecap under there if it is entirely taped over?
I'm not even going to answer that question. If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.

[LaxRef]

I'll rephrase that. Will the referee ever untape my butt to see what's under it?

Excuse me?! :chuckle:

[Jpettit25]

Thank you. That's all I was looking for.

[old geezer]

I am speaking only for NCAA interpretation. If you tape the end of the stick with a 'donut', the rule of thumb is that it must extend past the end of the stick by at least 1/4" and be of sufficient thickness to provide enough cushion to prevent injury, mainly internal injury should you have the misfortune of being jammed against the butt end.

In regard to the person( :dummy: ) who wishes to use a metal cap and tape over it, just remember that the metal could have a sharp edge and could, through wear and tear and your negligence, wear through the tape and injure someone. And if your opponent has done this, you could be the person cut by the metal cap. So ask yourself, is it worth it circumventing the rules just so you can say you did it. Remember, what goes around, comes around. Get rid of the metal cap.

[Jpettit25]

I don't use a bottlecap "Just so I can say I did it." There wouldn't be much point in that, would there? I use it because it feels comfortable for me and it's what I've used for a long time now. I don't like the feel of a normal rubber butt end, but I don't like the feel of just tape, either. The bottlecap is a good median between those two levels of prevalance of the butt end.

[LaxRef]

I don't use a bottlecap "Just so I can say I did it." There wouldn't be much point in that, would there? I use it because it feels comfortable for me and it's what I've used for a long time now. I don't like the feel of a normal rubber butt end, but I don't like the feel of just tape, either. The bottlecap is a good median between those two levels of prevalance of the butt end.

Then why not use plastic?

[CoachRob]

Or buy the tight butt end cap, which is a great product.

http://gtglax.com/advanced_search_result.php?keywords=tight+butt&osCsid=850620b787c8d225bae3a30184e26073

http://sportstop.zoovy.com/product/BRINEHK3

http://sportstop.zoovy.com/product/BRINEHK3?META=nextag-BRINEHK3

But one and it lasts forever. No taping needed and no sharp edges, either.

[RockStar]

....to provide enough cushion to prevent injury, mainly internal injury should you have the misfortune of being jammed against the butt end......

Just curious:

What's the penalty in NCAA/NFHS for butt-ending?

In case anyone cares, it's a very severe penalty in box:

-attempted butt-end is a 5:00 major penalty (short handed for five minutes or two goals, player is not even released after two goals, but team may play at full strength.

I have to check my trusty rulebook, but I believe if you actually connect with the butt-end, it's a match penalty (Ejection, 5:00 major to be served by another player on the team, likely suspended for your next game).

[Snake~eyes]

Just curious:

What's the penalty in NCAA/NFHS for butt-ending?

In case anyone cares, it's a very severe penalty in box:

-attempted butt-end is a 5:00 major penalty (short handed for five minutes or two goals, player is not even released after two goals, but team may play at full strength.

I have to check my trusty rulebook, but I believe if you actually connect with the butt-end, it's a match penalty (Ejection, 5:00 major to be served by another player on the team, likely suspended for your next game).
There is no specific penalty for what you listed but 1-3:00 penatly, possibly nonreleaseable and possible ejection. Discretion is left up to the officials.

[RockStar]

There is no specific penalty for what you listed but 1-3:00 penatly, possibly nonreleaseable and possible ejection. Discretion is left up to the officials.

OK, up to a 3:00 NR with possible ejection.

What do you call the penalty for the scoresheet? Slashing? or is there another less specific "illegal stickwork" or "attempt to injure" type penalty?

Mostly wondering, because I figure the butt-end might come up fairly frequently on botched "ice-pick" checks.

(ice-picks are also a big no-no here)

[ColtsLax]

Actually, my TightButt broke the other day, when i pulled it out to remove the weights, the screw disconnected from bottom and it just spins without engaging the nut

[CoachRob]

Well, now it's a Loose Butt. Sorry 'bout that.

[LaxRef]

OK, up to a 3:00 NR with possible ejection.

What do you call the penalty for the scoresheet? Slashing? or is there another less specific "illegal stickwork" or "attempt to injure" type penalty?

It is technically a slash, as is a poke check that doesn't hit the stick or the gloved hand on the sitck. However, you may well seen it called unnecessary roughness (or even USC if it is thought to be deliberate).

[CoachRob]

Is there a rule in NFHS against this that's specific to using the butt end of the crosse?

[LaxRef]

Is there a rule in NFHS against this that's specific to using the butt end of the crosse?

Nothing specific, which is why slashing applies.

[stix1025]

coach rob and lax Ref, many of the division one players in the recent tournament had taped endcaps. They just wrapped tape around the bottom of the shaft. they did not even cover the hole. So obviously taping the butt end is legal even leaving the hole open is, or else if it wasn't legal, these refs would have called it. correct me if I am wrong. Also, i think the reason tons of people are taping their own endcaps is because they think it is cool. lol thats all.

[LaxRef]

coach rob and lax Ref, many of the division one players in the recent tournament had taped endcaps. They just wrapped tape around the bottom of the shaft. they did not even cover the hole. So obviously taping the butt end is legal even leaving the hole open is, or else if it wasn't legal, these refs would have called it.

That is just really bad logic. The fact that an official doesn't call something doesn't make it legal. In fact, by that logic, we can conclude that mouthguards are not required because we've often seen Final Four footage on the NCAA rules videos with guys playing without mouthguards.

The rulebook has this to say:

Note 2: All hollow crosse handles must have their exposed ends adequately covered with plastic, rubber or tape to prevent injury. The use of metal caps (e.g., bottle caps) are prohibited.

The fact that they're talking about hollow crosse handles is a good hint that they want the hole covered. But more than that, they want the end covered, and that gaping hole at the end of the stick is part of the end.

Finally, we're trying to prevent injury. Putting tape over the metal while leaving the hole exposed still presents a modest surface area, and IIRC, pressure = force/area. Thus, if you want to prevent injury, you're going to get the end completely taped over since that will provide a larger surface area.

[laxfan25]

Is there a rule in NFHS against this that's specific to using the butt end of the crosse?
If someone was trying an 'ice pick' check and got the player I would call the slash. If a guy is standing next to someone on the crease and just gives him a butt end in the gut, or lower, he's going out for the USC.

[LCNlaxman]

I viewed your site and the end is illegal. The hole in the end is dangerous. Taping is not considered adequate protection for the metal edge of a stick.

To repeat:
A metal handle that does not have a cap-plug on the end shall not be considered illegal; at the next whistle, it shall be removed from the game until corrected means that it's not illegal for purposes of penalties. But it is NOT legal to be used.

An end cap costs around $1.50. Just go buy one and do everybody a favor. What is it about the caps that bothers you? Does it interfere with your stick skills in any way?

If I'm reffing, it's out of the game but as I stated, no penalty against you.


The only thing is, i have a friend with a butt-end exactly like in my webshots (tape around the stick, covering bottom end, but leaving a hole) and he's been stick-checked numerous times and never been called for it. Also Mustang_lax has a butt end similar to mine, he just has a big wad of tape at the bottom (around, mind you, not covering the bottom) it ALSO has a hole in it, and he says refs have not called him for it.

[b_cannons_123]

u guys just need a butt cap and a ring of tape around it and vio'la. its like magic!

[Hookem]

If the ref cant see the beer cap, then its not illegal :p

[laxfan25]

If the ref cant see the beer cap, then its not illegal :p
Then why bother? In most cases in the past, guys just wanted to have a Bud Light bottlecap or the Bacardi bat on the end of their stick. It had nothing to do with comfort, just tryin' to be cool by implying that they like to drink, even if underage. I even had one HS kid this year who's uniform number was 151!
These guys just need a butt plug and end this silly discussion. They're illegal, but go ahead and put a big ball of tape over them. We won't care, but you can have the psychological satisfaction of knowing you're getting away with cheating. Yippee.

[stix1025]

lax ref, so it would be ok for me to tape all around the end of the shaft and cover the hole, and then tape the common endcap on top of that. the one that mike powell had in college. i would do that except cover the hole with some tape. would that be legal?

[LaxRef]

lax ref, so it would be ok for me to tape all around the end of the shaft and cover the hole, and then tape the common endcap on top of that. the one that mike powell had in college. i would do that except cover the hole with some tape. would that be legal?

Well, it sounds okay, but I'd have to see it. Any doubts, have the officials look at it before the game.

[RockStar]

.....I even had one HS kid this year who's uniform number was 151.....

I love it!

For one unorganized club team I play for, I wear #666. Being a math geek/engineer as well as a casual devil worshiper, I was toying with changing my number to a transcendental number such as e or π.....can't find a rule against non-integers anywhere!

[LaxRef]

I love it!

For one unorganized club team I play for, I wear #666. Being a math geek/engineer as well as a casual devil worshiper, I was toying with changing my number to a transcendental number such as e or ?.....can't find a rule against non-integers anywhere!

I pointed out to the captains at the game the other night that they all had prime numbers and asked if it was by design or an accident.

[laxfan25]

Was the HS kid with 151 as a number doing it because there was already a 51 so he taped a 1 in front of it or was it a legit 151? That is interesting.
It was his real number.

[LaxRef]

It was his real number.

He must have been a widebody!

[stix1025]

i would post pics, but i can't..lol

[AZReDWiNG]

It was his real number.

Ahahaha real number

I want someone to wear an imaginary number.. But would it be like 42i or not even there since it's imaginary? :chuckle:

[LaxRef]

Ahahaha real number

I want someone to wear an imaginary number.. But would it be like 42i or not even there since it's imaginary? :chuckle:

Can my number be, say, the 3 x 3 identity matrix? Or a complex number like sqrt(3)/2 + (1/2)i? Or how about epsilon?

[LCNlaxman]

You crazy people and your math... :chuckle:

[AZReDWiNG]

Can my number be, say, the 3 x 3 identity matrix? Or a complex number like sqrt(3)/2 + (1/2)i? Or how about epsilon?

I'm wearing phi to my next game. So when they announce it...

"Defensive play by number.. uhh, golden ratio.."

And isn't the number you just described coordinates to a unit triangle? In which case couldn't you wear a triangle on your jersey with a coordinate plane? :chuckle: (I could have sworn I've used the exact numbers, down to the i... I hate trig)

[moondog]

I KNOW lacrosse is personal preference, but STX makes a solid end cap that increases the torque and the wrist action for passing and shooting. Great for attack, mids,and even goalie outlets. I used to be a taper, but the STX Powerendcap is very good; certainly worth checking out. Helps me use my wrists and torque more with shooting.

[justlaxin484]

i have a normal warrior end cap with the center missing so its just lik the black thing around the shaft but you can still see the inside of the shaft. i put a bottle cap on the end of the shaft then put the original endcap back on so the edges of the bottle cap are cover but you can still see the middle of it, is this legal or not, i play attack if that matters at all (i doubt it) any help would be appreciated

[laxref39]

There is no specific penalty for what you listed but 1-3:00 penatly, possibly nonreleaseable and possible ejection. Discretion is left up to the officials.
I like to refer to it as "THE ICE PICK" and I think it should be outlawed as most players don't get stick when they attempt it!

[laxfan25]

Since the bottle cap is inside an allowed end cap Iwould let it go. What is the big deal with bottlecaps though???

[LCNlaxman]

i have a normal warrior end cap with the center missing so its just lik the black thing around the shaft but you can still see the inside of the shaft. i put a bottle cap on the end of the shaft then put the original endcap back on so the edges of the bottle cap are cover but you can still see the middle of it, is this legal or not, i play attack if that matters at all (i doubt it) any help would be appreciated


I agree with laxfan25, since it is covered by a legal end cap, i think it would be legal.

[ColtsLax]

they can cut you

Also, for the last regular season game, we all wore custom jerseys with greek letters. I was Omega, the end, cause i play D i end attackmans lives(in theory anyway)

[tomahawks11]

im a first year ref and we have been told that absolutely no player can have any metal showing in the butt end. unfortunately i have to agree with this rule because if a player cut down his stick the metal can be sharp and hurt someone if they get poked. As soon as i got home i even had to tape my stick at the bottom because it had no cap!!!!!

[geggieman]

just clarifying, i bet i'm just being stupid, but do you need to have a butt cap on a solid wood shaft? i'm leaning towards no...

[surveyor12]

No. A solid end does not require a cap.

[spenny]

a BEER CAP or any other metal cap is illegal, however an aquafina waterbottle cap or coke cape will be legal. Also to answer your question, no, the ref wouldn't untape your butt end.


if you go the soda bottle cap route,just be sure to measure your stick to make sure it isnt too long.

personally i think its all stupid. just put a plastic cap on there and be an individual when you play, not by how you tape your stick. as long as its legal, i'm not going to be impressed by HOW your stick looks, i'm going to be impressed by what you can do with it. so quit retaping the thing and go hit the wall