View Full Version : Question on the Ward rule
red9535
10-30-2005, 01:12 PM
I got called for warding left and right today, i have a quick question. Can someone define the rule for me? It was mostly when i was fighting for ground balls
dram183
10-30-2005, 01:25 PM
you can not use your offhand to push someone. On groundballs, you should be using two hands on your stick anyways. But if you do use one hand, keep the other at your side or something
LaxRef
10-30-2005, 01:49 PM
I got called for warding left and right today, i have a quick question. Can someone define the rule for me? It was mostly when i was fighting for ground balls
You were not warding!
A player in possession of the ball may not use his free hand or arm or any other part of his body to hold, push or control the direction of the movement of the crosse or body of the player applying the check.
A player in possession of the ball may protect his crosse with his hand, arm or other part of his body when his opponent makes a play to check his crosse.
A.R. 53. B1 swings at A1’s crosse. A1 pulls his crosse back with one hand and with the other arm absorbs blow by B1. A1 continues around B1, holding off B1’s crosse with his protecting arm. RULING: Technical foul against A1. A1 may not use his arm to hold, push or control the crosse or body of the player applying the check.
A.R. 54. A1, advancing toward B1, pulls his crosse back with one hand and protects his crosse with the other arm. A1 contacts B1’s crosse with protecting arm and continues to drive against B1 and his crosse. RULING: Technical foul against A1.
Since you didn't have possession, you weren't warding. However, you're still guilty of a foul: if you push or hold with a hand that is off the stick, you are guilty of an illegal push or hold. Officials will often call this "playing with the free hand," but it's really a push or a hold.
red9535
10-30-2005, 02:57 PM
You were not warding!
Since you didn't have possession, you weren't warding. However, you're still guilty of a foul: if you push or hold with a hand that is off the stick, you are guilty of an illegal push or hold. Officials will often call this "playing with the free hand," but it's really a push or a hold.
Yeah, they did actually say 'playing with the free hand' i assumed that meant it was a ward. Thank you for clearing this up for me!
Edit: One more question: Is the penalty for warding and playing with the free hand just a loss of posession?
LaxRef
10-30-2005, 05:19 PM
Yeah, they did actually say 'playing with the free hand' i assumed that meant it was a ward. Thank you for clearing this up for me!
Edit: One more question: Is the penalty for warding and playing with the free hand just a loss of posession?
For any technical foul committed by you, possession is awarded to your opponents if you have the ball or if the ball is loose at the time of the foul (usually, there will be a "play on" if the ball is loose). If the opponents have possession when you commit a technical foul, there will be a flag thrown and you'll serve a 30-second penalty (unless a goal is scored during the falg-down situation).
The rules for personal fouls are different.
ColtsLax
10-31-2005, 09:07 AM
so basically you cant move your arm if your being checked, otherwisem its a foul
LaxRef
10-31-2005, 01:22 PM
so basically you cant move your arm if your being checked, otherwisem its a foul
No. You can move your arm as long as it doesn't touch the defending player or his stick. Often, coaches and players will yell for a ward call when a player tries to ward but misses; that's not a foul.
Mavido
10-31-2005, 02:17 PM
You can move your arm, but so long as your not trying to push the defenders stick or the actual defender away, its just you moving your arm. Basic rule of thumb for one handed cradeling. Unless your going to grab your stick, dont move your arm.. because the ref can see what your doing one way when its another. They dont always see everything so a ward can be seen many different ways. Just keep your arm locked to block checks and then you dont have to worry about it.
LaxRef
10-31-2005, 04:02 PM
Again, you can move the arm all you want as long as you don't touch the defender or his stick. However, I agree that leaving it in one place is probably the safest thing to do.
BTW, if the defender puts his stick under the attacker's arm and the attacker lifts his arm up and over the stick to get away, this is not a ward, but coaches often try to get you to call one anyway.
Laxref_36
10-31-2005, 09:31 PM
Again, you can move the arm all you want as long as you don't touch the defender or his stick. However, I agree that leaving it in one place is probably the safest thing to do.
BTW, if the defender puts his stick under the attacker's arm and the attacker lifts his arm up and over the stick to get away, this is not a ward, but coaches often try to get you to call one anyway.
Usually, one sideline will yell for a "Ward" and the opponent yells for a "Hold".
Moreoften than not its neither/
HRLAXER
10-31-2005, 09:44 PM
i have a question that is slightly brought up by this question. if an attackman has a one hand cradle and the other arm out protecting his hand can i hit his arm? the attackman cried for slashing but the ref said he was using it as a sheild and so it was ok. i wanted to see if that was legal.
tjslax
11-01-2005, 07:05 AM
Your check must make contact with the man with the ball's stick or, hand on the stick. If you are just throwing checks at the arm, you may hear "get stick" one check before you hear "flag down". The official doesn't have to warn you though-to stay out of the box make sure you are hitting his stick.
LaxRef
11-01-2005, 07:37 AM
tjslax is correct: you technically have to hit the stick or the gloved hand on the stick. Any other strike or blow may be called a slash.
Also, if you repeatedly beat the gloved hand on the stick in an attempt to cause injury, that's a slash even though it's the gloved hand on the stick.
attackgod
11-08-2005, 06:54 PM
why must people use one hand honestly what is the point
dram183
11-08-2005, 07:17 PM
^...
so you can hide the ball from the man defending you? you can just rotate your body or move your arm and your body would always be inbetween the ball and your defender.
Lacrosse Ref LA
11-09-2005, 02:38 PM
So, you are an "attack god" and you don't know or use a one handed cradle? It is a great way to protect your stick while carrying the ball. When done correctly the defenseman can not check your stick allowing you to pass or shoot (quickly) without being checked. You only bring up your second hand a moment before you pass. Also the closer you keep the head of your stick near your head the less likely the defenseman will risk a slash and go for your stick. Any more lessons ?
3rdPersonPlural
11-09-2005, 05:45 PM
LRLA, a true attack God does not need to use ANY hands. AG is only pointing out the inadequecies of the merely human players.
laxfan25
11-09-2005, 07:46 PM
You guys are all being too harsh on Attack God! I'm sure he was referring to the infraction that the original poster was talking about - being called for pushing off with the free hand while going for a ground ball. As anyone knows, there is no play guaranteed to bring down more of a coach's wrath that missing a ground ball pickup with one hand. "USE BOTH HANDS!!" will rain down upon the offender. I'm sure that is what AG was referring to, correct?
3rdPersonPlural
11-10-2005, 01:31 PM
Well, twenty five, if he was, then we can poke at him in our best schoolmarm voices about clearly defining the subject and context of one's observation when contributing to a threaded internet discussion. Yup, one way or the other, we got 'im!
laxattack1616
12-16-2005, 03:32 PM
when i cradled one handed they called me for warding but i didnt touch the other player. Why would i get called and how can i aviod it.
laxfan25
12-16-2005, 03:46 PM
when i cradled one handed they called me for warding but i didnt touch the other player. Why would i get called and how can i aviod it.
Without seeing the play it's difficult to know if it was possibly an incorrect call or what. If you were not making contact with the player or his stick, the only thing I can envision is that you were moving your free arm up and down quite a bit, so it looked like a ward motion. Hard to say. You may want to keep the free arm a little stiller when running, would be my only suggestion.
OldLaxer
05-16-2007, 09:16 AM
You were not warding!
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCAA Rule 6-12
A player in possession of the ball may not use his free hand or arm or any other part of his body to hold, push or control the direction of the movement of the crosse or body of the player applying the check.
So if a larger player has the ball and "runs over" a smaller player, is this technically a ward?
LaxRef
05-16-2007, 09:48 AM
You were not warding!
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCAA Rule 6-12
A player in possession of the ball may not use his free hand or arm or any other part of his body to hold, push or control the direction of the movement of the crosse or body of the player applying the check.
So if a larger player has the ball and "runs over" a smaller player, is this technically a ward?
Technically, yes, according to the rule. I've been trying to get this clarified in the rules since it is almost universally allowed by the officials.
OldLaxer
05-16-2007, 10:26 AM
That's what I thought.
Thanks!
Shorelax
05-16-2007, 10:51 AM
Playing with the free hand is the correct call as LR pointed out much earlier iin the thread.
I have seen this much more at the youth level in the last couple of years and after discussions with players and coaches have attributed it to the proliferation of youth hockey in our region - midatlantic. Apparently the kids get into a scrum trying to control the puck and use their forearms to block other players.
This is a bit off topic - but has anyone else noticed this? I don't know much about hockey - other than they serve beer at the arena. Is this a legal hcokey move?
Is there a provision in the Warding rule for a "ward" with both hands on the stick.
e.g. A1 (in possession) runs into B1, shoulder first and then pushes B1 away with upper arm, elbow and fore-arm (in that order). [Think Big Middie (A1) vs Little Middie (B1)]
If you hold your arm out in front of your stick while one-handed cradling, and your opponent goes for your stick but hits your arm, but you keep your arm in a stationary position, not moving it, as in trying to push the defender away, is that a ward? Because my coaches tell me to do it and I see it all the time in high school and college play.
That's fine....as long as your free arm is not moving
czechinthepipes
05-16-2007, 11:00 PM
I know what warding is (basically) but I have a question, whenever my friend and I do 1 on 1's we are constantly like on each other defending each other, we just go around in like circles while he tries to get the ball out. So since he is always close to me, when I try to one hand cradle and guard my stick, I start to put my none-stick hand out in the upside down L shape, he hits my arm while I'm moving it and he always says I'm warding him. I know he is probably correct but I want to get your guys' opinions and to see what a ref would do if something like this happened. I don't mean to like push his stick away, but it just randomly happens.
Woodenstick
05-17-2007, 06:32 AM
If your arm moves towards the defenders stick and makes contact, it will likely be called a ward. When players hold their arm out in an unnatural position, even a small movement will generate a ward call. You are best off getting your arm position established before the defender throws a check.
PlayOn
05-18-2007, 02:47 AM
A ward is tricky because as someone pointed out earlier half the time you get a hybrid ward vs hold situation and in that case you just let them play. I call wards less than I probably should to be honest, it's something I am going to try to work on since it is a becoming more frequent here at the MS level, especially with the older kids (8th graders). I try not to call it unless it is a blatant attempt to gain an advatage, a little juke action I will usually let go if it's a really physical game.
wolfenburg
05-18-2007, 03:41 AM
another question:
If A cradels one handed and moves hiss off hand in a natural way while he running and B makes contact with his of hand. Is this a ward?
pboyd
05-18-2007, 04:52 AM
No - this sounds like natural movement as a player is running with the ball. Officilas will look for "hold, push or control" before calling a ward.
LaxRef
05-18-2007, 08:24 AM
No - this sounds like natural movement as a player is running with the ball. Officilas will look for "hold, push or control" before calling a ward.
A.R. 60. A1, advancing toward B1, pulls his crosse back with one hand and protects his crosse with the other arm. A1 contacts B1’s crosse with protecting arm and continues to drive against B1 and his crosse. RULING: Technical foul against A1