Munich

[cbhslacrossemid]

I just can home from watching the best film of the year. It was one of the best films I have ever seen. Incredibly realistic and profound. It is a definate look into the world of the Mossad and the world of espionage in the early 70's. I recommend seeing it. Nay, it is a must see.

[JoshM]

Cool, glad to hear it was good. I'm looking forward to seeing it.

[laxkid009]

i am surely going to go see that. Looks like a good film

[gigo567]

I am going to see it and nothing is going to stop me.

[Frndlefire]

yea... I hate to admit it, but it's probably going to be very good

[franks2089]

Just got back from seeing it. I really liked it, but the ending sucked. It didnt do anything. It was him just standing in a park alone.

[sweet_ceX]

I am undoubtidly going to see this. Entertainment Weekley said it was the best movie of the year.
I love movies that have something to do with whats going on in the world.

[Formerlaxdemon]

I am undoubtidly going to see this. Entertainment Weekley said it was the best movie of the year.
I love movies that have something to do with whats going on in the world.


Not really a current events flick there. I am curious as to how/if they portray Carlos the Jackal in it.

[PompLax14]

Carlos the Jackal is not in it. His name is just mentioned. It was an excellent film and I really enjoyed it. I thought Eric Bana made an excellent Jew, but Steve, the blonde haired guy (Daniel Craig, new James Bond) was not believable at all as a Jew.

[sweet_ceX]

Not really a current events flick there. I am curious as to how/if they portray Carlos the Jackal in it.
Well, i ment "current" in a broad aspect, like the aspect of terrorism.

[laxattack8888]

Yeah, franks and I just got back from seeing it. Pretty sweet movie, if this thread wasn't started I would have started it. Really gory, but awesome and the story was good as well. Looks like Daniel Craig will be a good James Bond after seeing that.

[PompLax14]

Anyone else think that the Dutch girl with her boobs and chach hanging out with all that blood and holes in her was d i s g u s t i n g? 'Cause I did. I saw it with my dad too so it was kind've weird.

[nemesislax]

is that the movie about the munich olympics?

[MeRattack]

i bet its not as good as the ringer...haha

[OldGoalie]

Don't go in expecting a factually correct story, because the movie is "inspired by actual events" and is riddled with factual errors. It's based on a semi-factual book written in the 70's by George Jonas. What bugs me the most about it is it seems to take the Hollywood-lefty view that retribution for brutal murder is morally equivalent to terrorism. This sort of appeasement view drives me crazy, and suggests we should just sit back and let terrorism happen because two wrongs don't make a right. Hogwash...

[PompLax14]

Don't go in expecting a factually correct story, because the movie is "inspired by actual events" and is riddled with factual errors. It's based on a semi-factual book written in the 70's by George Jonas. What bugs me the most about it is it seems to take the Hollywood-lefty view that retribution for brutal murder is morally equivalent to terrorism. This sort of appeasement view drives me crazy, and suggests we should just sit back and let terrorism happen because two wrongs don't make a right. Hogwash...

So when someone is wronged they should be able to go out and murder whoever they want?

[HdGLaxWarrior]

I want to see this movie. It looks pretty good.

[franks2089]

So when someone is wronged they should be able to go out and murder whoever they want?
yep sdfsdfsfsfsdfsfsdfsdfsdfsdfsdfsdf

[OldGoalie]

So when someone is wronged they should be able to go out and murder whoever they want?

That's not what I said at all. And why would someone be able to go and murder whomever they want? That doesn't make any sense.

My point was that an act of terrorism, which is essentially what the Munich murders by the Palestinian "Black September" group were, deserves an equal response. The alternative, to sit back and try to understand "the root causes" invites more terrorist acts. Clinton could have acted more decisively against Bin Laden in the 90's after the first WTC attack in 1993, or after the U.S. Embassy was bombed in Kenya 1998 (yeah, we sent cruise missiles but they did nothing), but chose to go the U.N. sanction route. You see what that got us - 9/11. Most European nations chose to appease Hitler in WWII also because they thought he would stop eventually. It was only the brave nations who were willing to stand up and call evil by name who stopped him. Islamic terrorism deserves the same response.

[PompLax14]

Islamic terrorism deserves the same response.

What about other terrorists? You sound like an angry jew. Someone who is mad because the movie had a conscience. What they did was just as wrong as what Black September did, except they chose not to make public spectacles of all of their killings.

[OldGoalie]

What about other terrorists? You sound like an angry jew. Someone who is mad because the movie had a conscience. What they did was just as wrong as what Black September did, except they chose not to make public spectacles of all of their killings.

An "angry Jew"? What exactly is that supposed to mean? You sound like a leftist apologist.

I'm not mad because the movie had a conscience. I'm mad because it's a false portrayal, and because I don't believe in moral equivalency. Golda Meier and the Mossad agents on whom the story is based reportedly never waivered in their convictions, as the movie would have you believe. What they did was NOT just as wrong, and their killings were quite public, in fact. I'm mad because people will take this movie as fact, and it's anything but. Do a little research on the topic and you'll see what I mean. Tony Kushner, whom Spielberg hired to write the screenplay, is one of the most anit-Israel and anti-U.S. people around, even though he's Jewish. See this:

http://smoothstone.blogspot.com/2005/07/steven-spielberg-phone-home-already.html
and:
"In all of this one sees the biases of Tony Kushner, the radical playwright brought in by Spielberg to reshape the script. Kushner has repeatedly called the creation of Israel a "mistake," blamed Israel for "the whole shameful history of the dreadful suffering of the Palestinian people," and advocated policies to undermine the state."
http://nashvillesnews.net/node/54605

Not exactly a balanced portrayal, would you say?

And, what "other terrorists" would you be referring to? Do you see a lot of Christians, Jews, Hindus and Buddhists strapping bombs to their bodies an murdering innocents?

[PompLax14]

First off, are you Jewish? I want a simple yes or no.

I'm not sure if you actually watched the movie, but Avner (sp?) definitely "waivers in his convictions". I expect most people would, when they know that they are committing murder. What I said was they did not make a public spectacle of it. They didn't try to cover it up but they didn't go on live tv and say, "This is for all our fellow jew brothers! Mossad 4 lyfe!".

And obviously you don't know me, because I am anything but a leftist apologist.

[OldGoalie]

First off, are you Jewish? I want a simple yes or no.

I'm not sure if you actually watched the movie, but Avner (sp?) definitely "waivers in his convictions". I expect most people would, when they know that they are committing murder. What I said was they did not make a public spectacle of it. They didn't try to cover it up but they didn't go on live tv and say, "This is for all our fellow jew brothers! Mossad 4 lyfe!".

And obviously you don't know me, because I am anything but a leftist apologist.

What difference does it make? I believe in what's right, regardless of my race/religion. As an American, I'm outraged as well. As for your other points, reread my post above.

[PompLax14]

Answer the question. Are you Jewish? If you refuse to answer I will just take that as a yes.

[OldGoalie]

Answer the question. Are you Jewish? If you refuse to answer I will just take that as a yes.

Answer my question - what difference does it make in the answer? The film is a biased fictional portrayal, regardless of what I am.

[PompLax14]

Answer my question - what difference does it make in the answer? The film is a biased fictional portrayal, regardless of what I am.

It makes a difference because then you will have to admit that you are unable to look at this problem objectively. It is my belief that you are Jewish, and are biased against Arabs which is why you have such a problem with this film. You need to learn a lot of things, such as Jews are not infallible, Arabs are not always the bad guy, and you need to know when you're prejudices interfere with your ability to be impartial.

[gigo567]

Guys stop arguing. Just PM each other if you are going to argue.

[lax4life56]

yikes guys. how bout them red sox, eh? just kidding. but this movie looks good. is it gory to the point where you do not wanna see it with your family?

[OldGoalie]

It makes a difference because then you will have to admit that you are unable to look at this problem objectively. It is my belief that you are Jewish, and are biased against Arabs which is why you have such a problem with this film. You need to learn a lot of things, such as Jews are not infallible, Arabs are not always the bad guy, and you need to know when you're prejudices interfere with your ability to be impartial.

Never said I was impartial or unbiased. Who is in this conflict? And I never said "all Arabs are bad." I specifically said "Islamic terrorism". Don't presume to tell me what I need to learn. And, by the way, you haven't refuted any of my arguments about the movie, which is the point of my post, not my religion.

[cbhslacrossemid]

The movie seems to drive these questions we're asking ourselves. Do two wrongs every make a right? My response: No. So how do you prevent terrorism? You can't. So what do you do? Well, thats what makes this movie so good, it's not just the "movie" its the way it makes you think.

[ShermanLax607]

ok, is this a good enough movie to go see with my parents?

i mean, its the day b4 new years eve, and if i dont go with them, i cant go partying with my special lady tomorrow night, and maybe.. well you know, and NO, im only 15...

im just saying, i hope this movie saves my evening because im getting dragged around, i hope this is good, by this thread it must be

[BTlaxripper]

I keep getting this movie confused with Syriana.

[PompLax14]

It's a good movie, as long as you approach it with an open mind. If you already have pre-conceived notions about the Munich Olympics and the events that this film depicts then don't see it because it probably won't be what you want. The Arabs do bad things. The Jews do bad things.

[PompLax14]

Never said I was impartial or unbiased. Who is in this conflict? And I never said "all Arabs are bad." I specifically said "Islamic terrorism". Don't presume to tell me what I need to learn. And, by the way, you haven't refuted any of my arguments about the movie, which is the point of my post, not my religion.

I'm completely unbiased in this conflict. I think it's easier for me because I'm not Jewish or Muslim, so it's not as close to me as it is others.

As for refuting any of your arguments, I'm not sure what they were, apart from the anti-Jew bias? This was a pretty balanced portrayal in my opinion. They make the Muslims the bad guys, and the Jews the good guys. However, they stick in the doubts of the team of Jews as a conscience for this film. Murder is murder. Twist it any way you want. An eye for an eye, revenge, etc... It's all wrong. It's vigilante justice and that just leads to more problems.

There are reasons that courts and prisons were created, and it wasn't to look pretty and give people jobs.

[OldGoalie]

I'm completely unbiased in this conflict. I think it's easier for me because I'm not Jewish or Muslim, so it's not as close to me as it is others.

As for refuting any of your arguments, I'm not sure what they were, apart from the anti-Jew bias? This was a pretty balanced portrayal in my opinion. They make the Muslims the bad guys, and the Jews the good guys. However, they stick in the doubts of the team of Jews as a conscience for this film. Murder is murder. Twist it any way you want. An eye for an eye, revenge, etc... It's all wrong. It's vigilante justice and that just leads to more problems.

There are reasons that courts and prisons were created, and it wasn't to look pretty and give people jobs.

The conflict doesn't end with Israel and the Palestinians. It goes well beyond, and affects us as Americans, which can't leave you completely unbiased.

I don't have to twist anything. That's my whole point. Murder is not murder, and it's not vigilante justice. They are simply not morally equivalent in my book. It's tantamount to an act of war, which is essentially what the Munich massacre was. By your logic, the U.S. was wrong to go after al Qaeda following 9/11 - or is that somehow justified?

[PompLax14]

The conflict doesn't end with Israel and the Palestinians. It goes well beyond, and affects us as Americans, which can't leave you completely unbiased.

I don't have to twist anything. That's my whole point. Murder is not murder, and it's not vigilante justice. They are simply not morally equivalent in my book. It's tantamount to an act of war, which is essentially what the Munich massacre was. By your logic, the U.S. was wrong to go after al Qaeda following 9/11 - or is that somehow justified?

We captured them and imprisoned them. We did not assassinate them. That is the difference! Why is that so difficult to understand!?

[OldGoalie]

{Post deleted}

[OldGoalie]

We captured them and imprisoned them. We did not assassinate them. That is the difference! Why is that so difficult to understand!?

You've got to be joking, or are you that naive? Every heard of a daisy cutter?

[laxattack8888]

^ Man you are an old goalie. We don't see too many 34 year olds on the forums. Nice to have your insight on this movie.

[PompLax14]

You've got to be joking, or are you that naive? Every heard of a daisy cutter?

It's a bomb. A lot easier to tell when people are dropping bombs on you than when they're hidden in your phone, under your bed, or when you're shot going home. This was not a war. It was multiple assassinations. Murder IS murder.

[OldGoalie]

It's a bomb. A lot easier to tell when people are dropping bombs on you than when they're hidden in your phone, under your bed, or when you're shot going home. This was not a war. It was multiple assassinations. Murder IS murder.

Oh really? Tell that to the people who got killed by daisy cutters. And this was absolutely the start of war. The Munich murders were widely regarded as having begun the campaign of worldwide terrorism, i.e. the beginning of an era. Again, I can commend the movie for depicting the Israeli Mossad agents as having a conscience, but not for portraying them as wavering in their commitment to do what had to be done.

Look, let's just agree to disagree. You and I will never see eye to eye on this, and I'm tired of this thread. Happy New Year.