Sub Box Situation

[eme]

Ball is loose.

B1 sub in sub area waits for player B2 to exit, but does not yield for A1 who is subbing off for A2. A1 decides to a) push b) illegal body check
B1.

What options do you have?

How would your answer change if a) A has possession b) B has possession??

[boxlaxman]

A) Push (as in intentional and not accidental) - Unnecessary Roughness possibly
B) Unnecessary Roughness definitely

The reason for the foul is not important at this point. If he just interferes and does not try to push or IBC B2, play on interference and ball to A.

[LaxRef]

Ball is loose.

B1 sub in sub area waits for player B2 to exit, but does not yield for A1 who is subbing off for A2. A1 decides to a) push b) illegal body check
B1.

What options do you have?

How would your answer change if a) A has possession b) B has possession??

If ball is loose: Play-on technical foul on B2, which is then ended by (a) loose-ball push by A1; award balll to A (b) IBC by A1 (simultaneous fouls; B1 serves 30 seconds, A1 serves 1:00, first 30 NR, award ball to B).

If A has possession: Flag-down technical foul on B2, which is then ended by (a) push by A1; award balll to A and B2 serves 30 seconds (b) IBC by A1 (simultaneous fouls; B1 serves 30 seconds, A1 serves 1:00, first 30 NR; award ball to B ).

If B has possession: Kill play immediately for techincal by team in possession. A would be awarded the ball, but then (a) A commits a dead-ball push (and it sounds like this is not the kind of dead-ball technical you'd ignore), so give the ball back to B (b) A commits a dead-ball personal. A1 serves 1:00, B1 serves no time, and B gets possession.

[RottingMind13]

LaxRef, is it a technical because B1 has to yield to the player coming off of the field?

[LaxRef]

LaxRef, is it a technical because B1 has to yield to the player coming off of the field?

Yes, that's the reason:

The substitute must always yield his position in the special substitution area to any player exiting the field.

[eme]

Yes, Laxref, you are correct. But it took me several miles on the journey home to sort it out. I was the single side on the play and didn't see the play...so the info was relayed to me by the trail. Based on the heat of the moment and without time to sort it all out completely...I did none of the above...but everyone seemed to like the adjudication. Someday I'll tell you...but don't want to display my incompetence in public more than I already do....

[LaxRef]

I did none of the above...but everyone seemed to like the adjudication.

Well, we all know that if you give the correct ruling in a game for the "ball loose/A1 commits personal" situation, everyone will think you're a moron for sitting B1 for 0:30 for a loose-ball technical. :chuckle:

[eme]

I think the best answer would have been that new ncaa simultaneous rule for play-on loose-ball technical followed by other team's personal.

30 seconds for the interference. 1 min. for the IBC.
But I wasn't quick/good enough to do this.

[LaxRef]

I think the best answer would have been that new ncaa simultaneous rule for play-on loose-ball technical followed by other team's personal.

30 seconds for the interference. 1 min. for the IBC.
But I wasn't quick/good enough to do this.

The NCAA rule actually isn't new, it's just that most people didn't make the inference necessary to realize this was the right call. I actually thought it was a mistake, so I submitted the new A.R. and said, "If this is what you really want, you should put this A.R. in," thinking that they didn't really want that. But they did.

BTW, same call should be made in NFHS lacrosse even though the A.R. isn't there because the text of the simul. foul rule is the same.

[shrekjr]

I'm with eme...having time to look back and think it through, of course LaxRef is correct. However, at the time in the heat of the battle, I don't know that I would have done it right either.

[MElaxRef]

Good explanation by LaxRef.

This is a situation that the NFHS CBO should handle to perfection, the next time a high school uses a 4 man crew.

The NCAA gave up the CBO, so this call belongs to either Lead (impossible if he is covering a fast break) or Trail (once he gets close enough to the substitution area to see the failure to yield). Sounds like eme's Trail was there, but confused by the simultaneous foul situation.

[LaxRef]

Good explanation by LaxRef.

This is a situation that the NFHS CBO should handle to perfection, the next time a high school uses a 4 man crew.

I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for that one, at least not around here. :chuckle: