Subbing after time serving fouls/NFHS

[gfink]

Would all of you like to weigh in on this:

NFHS rule 4-23 art 3... Regular substitutions may not take place after play has been suspended for violations or inadvertant whistles.

Please define violations and if possible find it in the rulebook. :WTF:

[LaxRef]

Would all of you like to weigh in on this:

NFHS rule 4-23 art 3... Regular substitutions may not take place after play has been suspended for violations or inadvertant whistles.

Please define violations and if possible find it in the rulebook. :WTF:

I got them to fix this in the NCAA rulebook, which now says:

b. Regular substitutions may not take place after play has been suspended for non-time-serving penalties or inadvertent whistles.

[Snake~eyes]

The intent of the rule is timeserving violations. It is definitely an error and needs to be fixed, regular substitution after every violation would be horrible. Yuck!

[gfink]

I was aware of the NCAA ruling, which is why the NFHS screwed me up. It happened to come up in a HS game i was doing. After reporting a penalty, my partner started play while the the man-down team was subbing. I stopped play and let them finish thier sub. No harm no foul. The other coach wanted a delay of game penalty called. When i informed him they were allowed to sub and it was our(officials) fault, he informed me there were no regular substitutions permitted after a time serving foul. Go figure. The rulebook currently allows for this interpretation.

[CoachRob]

gfink,
I brought this up in class with you. It is really poorly worded and needs to be corrected in NFHS rules. But as you said, no harm, no foul. Curious if they asked for a horn and received one, however.

[gfink]

no horn needed, none given. actually this probably all your fault. not sure how, but it works for me.

[LaxRef]

no horn needed, none given. actually this probably all your fault. not sure how, but it works for me.

I'm confused about what people are confused about.

You can have regular (horn) subs after a time-serving penalty or a goal or a sideline OOB. In NFHS, you technically still have to call for the horn in the latter two situations, although no one does. Under NCAA, as of 2006, regular subs are automatically allowed after a goal or a time-serving penalty without requesting a horn.

Regular (horn) subs are not allowed on a non-time-serving technical foul or on an endline OOB.

The one that's unclear is: Loose ball. B1 pushes A1, play on. Then B1 kicks the ball OOB on the sideline and the whistle blows. Can you get a horn sub? Is play suspended for the technical foul or the OOB? :thinking:

[LaxRef]

The intent of the rule is timeserving violations. It is definitely an error and needs to be fixed, regular substitution after every violation would be horrible. Yuck!

It says regular substitution may not take place after violations (they mean non-time-serving, but I think it's more poorly worded than an outright error).

[Shorelax]

The one that's unclear is: Loose ball. B1 pushes A1, play on. Then B1 kicks the ball OOB on the sideline and the whistle blows. Can you get a horn sub? Is play suspended for the technical foul or the OOB? :thinking:

I believe play is suspended by the OOB. If A1 gains possesion of the ball, before it goes OOB, there is no technical foul.

I would allow the horn. A1's ball.

But, what if A1 kicks the ball OOB?? Who gets the ball?

[LaxRef]

I believe play is suspended by the OOB. If A1 gains possesion of the ball, before it goes OOB, there is no technical foul.

I would allow the horn. A1's ball.

But, what if A1 kicks the ball OOB?? Who gets the ball?

Clearly team A, since they were due the ball. This would even be true if A1 committed a technical foul (but not a personal, since then we have a simultaneous foul situation with the offended team committing a personal foul; then B1 would serve 30 seconds, A1 would serve 1:00 or more, and team B would get the ball).

[gfink]

no horn needed, none given. actually this probably all your fault. not sure how, but it works for me.

this is a joke. not a serious reply. thank you. :bartmoon:

[LaxRef]

this is a joke. not a serious reply. thank you. :bartmoon:

I knew you weren't serious about the "all your fault" part but there is a lot of confusion out there about when the teams are required to call for a horn.