BallStops?

[dskinner21]

Is not having having a ballstop illegal and what purpose does the ballstop have.
I also would like to know that if you can just call stick checks randomly and if you are allowed to call them on everyone or do u have a limit?
And can goalies have an illegal pocket and can you call a stick check on them?

[$moneylax]

this might not all be true, but this is what I know:
It is not illegal to not have a ballstop, it cushions the ball if it somehow bounces off that part of your stick , and some people use them to help keep the ball in (like piching a stick), I think that coaches can request 1 stick check, but refs can call as many as needed. and there are no limitations on goalie sticks.

[RockStar]

Jesus, this is the guy trying to tell me that some shafts are too strong.

-You need a ballstop. There is no reason why you need one, but it's in the rules, so you do.

-My understanding is you can call more than one check if you want. You get one freebie (no penalty if the stick comes up clean), and you start getting penalized after the one freebie if you're asking for clean sticks to be checked.

-I'm not sure if there's any realistic way that a goalie could have an illegal pocket. I don't think there's a depth restriction.

[Laxref_36]

this might not all be true, but this is what I know:
It is not illegal to not have a ballstop, it cushions the ball if it somehow bounces off that part of your stick , and some people use them to help keep the ball in (like piching a stick), I think that coaches can request 1 stick check, but refs can call as many as needed. and there are no limitations on goalie sticks.


Page 14 2006 NFHS Boys Lacrosse Rule Book states under Rule 1 Section 7 Art. 4 ..."All crosses shall have a guard stop. A crosse without a guard stop shall not be considered illegal, and at the next whistle, it shall be removed from play until corrected."

It begs the question: If a coach requests a stick check and the only thing wrong with the crosse is the ball stop, has the coach used his free check? As such is the next check which finds nothing illegal cost the coachs team a technical foul?

[Woodenstick]

Page 14 2006 NFHS Boys Lacrosse Rule Book states under Rule 1 Section 7 Art. 4 ..."All crosses shall have a guard stop. A crosse without a guard stop shall not be considered illegal, and at the next whistle, it shall be removed from play until corrected."

It begs the question: If a coach requests a stick check and the only thing wrong with the crosse is the ball stop, has the coach used his free check? As such is the next check which finds nothing illegal cost the coachs team a technical foul?

The inspection rule states that if the coach makes a second request "and all equipment is found to be legal, the head coach's team is penalized...." And as you quoted, the equipment rule specifically says that a stick is considered legal ("shall not be considered illegal") despite no ballstop. Therefore, it would seem to me that you lose your free check or get penalized (lost TO etc.) if all you catch is a missing ballstop.

From a policy point of view, do we want coaches calling equipment checks to catch missing ballstops? Does a missing ballstop justify another equipment check? No and No. I mean, who cares about missing ballstops, this rule is an anachronism going back to the [beautiful] days of wooden sticks.

[ColtsLax]

but what qualifys as a ballstop? can i just take a peice of athletic tape and put it in my head?

[LoyolaMiddie878]

i don't understand what the big deal with ballstops are. just have one.

it's not like they have any affect (positive or negative) to your stick in any way whatsoever. just have one. don't ask why. just do it.

[strongisland]

i don't understand what the big deal with ballstops are. just have one.

it's not like they have any affect (positive or negative) to your stick in any way whatsoever. just have one. don't ask why. just do it.


whenever i get an unstrung head they dont come with ball stops so lots of kids dont have them

[laxfan25]

but what qualifys as a ballstop? can i just take a peice of athletic tape and put it in my head?
Interesting question, and since the rule book doesn't define the construction of a ballstop, it would pass in my inspection.

[RockStar]

Interesting question, and since the rule book doesn't define the construction of a ballstop, it would pass in my inspection.
ditto.

Rule book doesn't tell us what a ballstop is. Therefore, damn near anything you put on your stick and call a ballstop is such.

[adobekid9]

i just use a piece of tape is that ok

[EndlesFimbulvet]

Yes.

Strongisland, I believe you have my stapler.

[nikewarrior5]

so if a ref says that tape isnt a ball stop are you allowed to say, "there are no defined rules in the construction of the ball stop" and then he will let it go or what

[RockStar]

so if a ref says that tape isnt a ball stop are you allowed to say, "there are no defined rules in the construction of the ball stop" and then he will let it go or what
That's the correct call.

Whether the ref makes the correct call or not...............

[Woodenstick]

Personally, I would let tape go as a ballstop, because I don't think that it matters. But I really couldn't fault a ref who insisted on a more traditional ballstop made of rubber. Ballstop is not defined, but that does not automatically mean that anything goes, it means that there is a gray area in the rules and the ref has to use his best judgment. Since ballstops are always made of rubber (i.e., rubbery like material) I think a ref could fairly interpret the rule as requiring such material.

[WHEELAX2]

Personally, I would let tape go as a ballstop, because I don't think that it matters. But I really couldn't fault a ref who insisted on a more traditional ballstop made of rubber. Ballstop is not defined, but that does not automatically mean that anything goes, it means that there is a gray area in the rules and the ref has to use his best judgment. Since ballstops are always made of rubber (i.e., rubbery like material) I think a ref could fairly interpret the rule as requiring such material.


considering the first ball stop was cat gut, I don't think that is necessarily rubber..

same thing goes with the construction of the stick.. it used to be one solid piece of wood..

see what i'm getting at?

from a traditionalists point of view, I would suggest that it should be a rule in the spirit of the game.. much like the construction of the pocket.. either out of synthetic, or leather/animal material..

I would consider tape a synthetic materail meant to replace the cat gut, just as mesh pockets replaced leather thongs

[RockStar]

Wheelax has it right.

I will not slow down a game just to enforce rules that a) aren't defined with adequate clarity, and b) arguably don't matter much either way.

So, if the rules/ref manual don't tell me exactly what a legal ballstop is and exactly what happens when someone doesn't have one that matches the description...........Well then, anything / everything is a legal ballstop as long as it doesn't cause the stick to be illegal in some other way (-ballstop too thick and causes stick to fail rollout test, ballstop too thick and causes length to be under 10" etc.).

[pINK fLOYD]

what if the tape you put was faced up so the tape woould stick to the ball...what would happen.

[WHEELAX2]

what if the tape you put was faced up so the tape woould stick to the ball...what would happen.


well.. a stick can not "retard" the ball from coming out.. essentially, it would fail the stick test, as it would not roll out cleanly...

therefore.. illegal..

[goalie33fan]

I'm confused. Do I need one or not?

[pINK fLOYD]

well.. a stick can not "retard" the ball from coming out.. essentially, it would fail the stick test, as it would not roll out cleanly...

therefore.. illegal..
how would would it not do the same thing as a ballstop though?, but thanks for the clarification

[nikewarrior5]

I'm confused. Do I need one or not?

you need one, it just isn't defined as to what the ballstop should be.

[dskinner21]

so does tape work

[mattf73]

the ball stop is like the 'chin guard' on bucket helmets. I think they are carried over from old school rules (the chin guard was there to protect people because their 2-point helmet strap could not stop the face grill smashing into them). Ppl used to put 2 ball stops in hi-walls/excaliburs/sams to create the same effect as a pinched head, but now that the throats of heads are pinched the ballstops have shrunk so small to be just a token gesture...i'm sure they will disappear altogether soon as it has outlived its requirement

[laxfan25]

FYI - the new NCAA rules have specifically removed the requirement to have a ball stop. While the NFHS book still calls for one they have changed the measurement of 10" from the top of the head to the stop from the farthest EXPOSED edge to the farthest Unexposed edge (i.e. the plastic of the head) which is what the NCAA book used to state.

[LaxRef]

FYI - the new NCAA rules have specifically removed the requirement to have a ball stop. While the NFHS book still calls for one they have changed the measurement of 10" from the top of the head to the stop from the farthest EXPOSED edge to the farthest Unexposed edge (i.e. the plastic of the head) which is what the NCAA book used to state.

Also, NFHS rules specifically state that having two ball stops is a 3:00 NR penalty.

[pboyd]

In 2009 we won't have this problem...ball stop no longer required.

[LaxRef]

In 2009 we won't have this problem...ball stop no longer required.

I wonder if this part of the rule release was an error. If you're going to no longer require a ball stop, why wait until 2009? The rest of that stuff makes sense to delay, but I think they may take the ball stop part out this year. We should know in a month or so.

[LaxRef]

I wonder if this part of the rule release was an error. If you're going to no longer require a ball stop, why wait until 2009? The rest of that stuff makes sense to delay, but I think they may take the ball stop part out this year. We should know in a month or so.

Yep, 2007 NCAA rules: ball stop no longer required. It is still required for NFHS rules.

[weeman]

if your playing high school you need a ballstop. you can either use tape or a ball stop because the rules dont classify what a ball stop is.

[LaxRef]

if your playing high school you need a ballstop. you can either use tape or a ball stop because the rules dont classify what a ball stop is.
That's a non sequitur. The rules don't specify what mesh is either, so does that mean you can use a head of cabbage?

[Live4It]

That's a non sequitur. The rules don't specify what mesh is either, so does that mean you can use a head of cabbage?
That would be difficult to string.

[RockStar]

That's a non sequitur. The rules don't specify what mesh is either, so does that mean you can use a head of cabbage?

Know what?

If some stickdoctor can make a pocket out of cabbage that doesn't contravene any clearly written rule, I'm allowing it!

[massref]

I don't know which is most obsurd someone taking time to write some of these comments or my taking time to read them. In any case, it is entertaining most of the time.